Midland
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,871
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Post by Midland on Aug 3, 2018 13:52:54 GMT
Well I found it fascinating as Curly was my grandfather's vintage and I am 77! What we do find out a hundred years or so later. D
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,901
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Post by jma1009 on Aug 4, 2018 21:49:51 GMT
I wrote out a 'summary' of the EIM article of Johnson and Pollard a few years ago, and here are a few salient points:
LBSC's father was originally "Morris Benjamin", but changed his name to "Henry Mathieson" after LBSC was born.
LBSC's birth certificate states he was born 27th September 1883 as "William Morris Benjamin". LBSC's father's parents were Jewish.
By the time of the 1891 census LBSC is now "William M Mathieson" (aged 7).
By the time of LBSC's marriage to Mabel in 1908 his name was now "Lillian Lawrence".
LBSC died 5th November 1967 aged 84, and Mabel died in 1972.
The records of LBSC's employment with the LBSCR survive at Kew, and he joined the LBSCR aged 15 7th September 1899 at 2/- a day as a cleaner at New Cross.
The last record of his employment with the LBSCR is in 1902.
So actually LBSC was employed by the LBSCR all told less than 2 and a half years. He never got above the grade of cleaner, and never became a fireman or driver on the LBSCR, though his writings would have you believe otherwise in respect of his footplate experiences he described in print. But it is not unusual for a keen railway employee to get all sorts of opportunities, as I experienced myself some 100 years later!
Cheers,
Julian
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Post by terrier060 on Aug 5, 2018 20:17:23 GMT
What an interesting thread this has been. Although I have never built one of LBSC's locos, I have always admired him and read his articles when I was a kid in the 1950s and 1960s. I have several of his books including an original shops shed and road that used to belong to Harry Clarkson who I met not long before he died. I was building his 3.5 inch gauge Princess Royal. I also have the live steam book. I built several of his injectors, following the ' words and music'. They were simple to build and have always worked reliably.
Your thread has inspired me to buy the biography and also his pamphlet on building 'speedy' a locomotive I have always admired since being brought up on Bill Perrett's at the Soton track in the 1960s. I have seen many of his different models over the years built by various model engineers, and they all look tidy and to scale. They all seem to run smoothly and steam well. There have been many criticisms of loco designers over the years, but without them the model world would have lost so much.
Many thanks for your most interesting thread and I am looking forward to reading the biography. Ed
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Post by silverfox on Aug 6, 2018 7:48:04 GMT
Ed
If you are contemplating doing Speedy, i can give no better advice than to studiously look at Rogers build log. As regards the Hollingsworth book on LBSC be aware of stupid prices. I managed to get one a few weeks ago on ebay at under 20.00. and i would say make that your benchmark.
Regards
Ron
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Post by terrier060 on Aug 6, 2018 10:37:01 GMT
Thanks Ron. Yes I love Roger's thread and he has convinced me that it is worth giving CNC a go. At 73 I feel like a new challenge! The machine should be here any minute. I have a crane ready! Ed
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Post by silverfox on Aug 6, 2018 15:55:44 GMT
Ed A few rules (lol)
No such thing as a stupid question
Never to old to learn something new
If you see something you like that someone else has done/made .Copy iy or ask how it is done.No one on here is that 'anal'
If you do something that makes life easier, put it up, someone on here will benefit from it
And one i havent abided by much ( mainly because i cannot figure out all these photo programmes) is put up pics
Thsts about it
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Post by terrier060 on Aug 14, 2018 8:04:17 GMT
How true!
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Tony K
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,573
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Post by Tony K on Aug 14, 2018 8:35:55 GMT
I am not really interested in LBSC's sexuality, personal stuff etc. - just interested in his models - I have a Netta.
I always try to keep in mind the number of models he did in a relatively short time and the state of the art at the time, when judging his wares.
Often I read critical comments on his valve gear etc. Remember he worked it all out with a cardboard trammel and string. A modern day Mr. Clever comes along 50 years later with a computer and software written by someone else and proceeds to criticise the original to demonstrate how clever they are. Nothing wrong in improving things with modern techniques - it is just the way it is done sometimes which I find offensive.
However, his writing technique of not repeating methods in, say, Netta articles by saying "like I did with Molly" and something else "like I did with Pansy" etc. is annoying now to many. Perhaps it was OK at the time though.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2018 8:42:34 GMT
However, his writing technique of not repeating methods in, say, Netta articles by saying "like I did with Molly" and something else "like I did with Pansy" etc. is annoying now to many. Perhaps it was OK at the time though. Curly was not alone in this respect Tony...Don does the same..one that stands out in my mind for Doncaster is the sanding gear steam valve...no details at all with a note to say that it can be bought from his company. He often refers readers to previous designs for 'how he did it', not much use to people building decades after... Pete
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Post by Oily Rag on Aug 14, 2018 20:48:43 GMT
However, his writing technique of not repeating methods in, say, Netta articles by saying "like I did with Molly" and something else "like I did with Pansy" etc. is annoying now to many. Perhaps it was OK at the time though. Curly was not alone in this respect Tony...Don does the same..one that stands out in my mind for Doncaster is the sanding gear steam valve...no details at all with a note to say that it can be bought from his company. He often refers readers to previous designs for 'how he did it', not much use to people building decades after... Pete Perhaps Editors did not like to pay the writer the page space that repeating previous text took up and told the writer so. The punters in the past have complained of repetition in the pages of their favourite mag. (Letters to the editor in ME mag for an example) The writers did not have the "Copy and paste function" installed in their pencils The ominous sound of the deadline approaching at Express speed, so the rush to publish, or perhaps just bone lazy. One or more of the above ?
I have a list of LL&S mags to find to complete my collection, hence my anguish.
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,901
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Post by jma1009 on Aug 14, 2018 22:43:00 GMT
Personally, the avoidance of repetition in construction series is quite understandable, and certain loco construction series are more detailed than others when one goes back to the glory years of ME. Most clubs have a full set of MEs so I cannot understand why there should be a problem in accessing back numbers referenced in one series to an earlier one.
The alternative is the very drawn out construction series of certain authors/designers in EIM ! Or compare instead Jack Austen Walton's 'Twin Sisters' in ME in the late 1940s and 50s which was equally 'drawn out'.
And many have built say Peter Rich's 5"g GWR Castle which was never completed as a construction series beyond what was (from memory) an introduction with lots of nice drawings but little else subsequently.
Add into the equation that LBSC's own construction series were rather odd. On one hand he described how to make a loco chassis and cylinders with in mind the very basic lathe and workshop most model engineers had in the 1930s, 40s, and 50s. And no milling machine. He did a lot of construction work for his early locos on a round bed Drummond with treadle power. But later on he had much better and bigger machinery plus a mill.
The oddness is in respect of his later boiler designs and construction description where he sifbronzed up initial joints with sifbronze using his oxy acetylene set, which has caused subsequently major problems in some of his boiler designs and descriptions when these boilers have been silver soldered throughout. Yet surely he knew that very few model engineers had access to oxy acetylene like he did!
The oddness is also in respect of the construction descriptions - the 'words and music' - being quite alien to those of you who do not have antiquated basic machinery in your workshops. Ergo they will be of little use.
One of my particular gripes of Don Young and LBSC is the use of 7BA threads often! I stick to the even numbered BA sizes except for 5BA which I also use. I've never used 7BA!
I have a collection of MEs going back to 1940. They take up a lot of space, and certain years are heavily covered in 'post it' tags with by now fading penciled or penned notes. Certain of LBSC's colourful and entertaining articles are old favourites and often dipped into.
Don Young never quite attained the same literary standard, and there were reasons for this. Martin Evans' construction descriptions just annoy me.
Cheers,
Julian
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