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Post by harryrobinson on Apr 15, 2019 17:02:44 GMT
Hi all,
I have only recently joined this forum, sorry if I am posting this in the wrong place! For a while I have been considering building my own loco to run at my local model engineering club. I currently have a 3 1/2 inch gauge small boiler Tich which I am working on (valve gear is a bit dodgy), but I’ve always wanted to build my own locomotive.
I found an engine I liked the look of, and that was the LBSC “Mona”. It is a 3 1/2 inch gauge 0-6-2 tank, and can be built with either slip-eccentric or radial valve gear. But would it be a good beginners loco? It has internal valve gear with a crankshaft, which looks very difficult to make (for somebody with minimal lathe experience), and I have been told that 3 1/2 is very fiddly, and not great for beginners.
Should I attempt this or should I find another engine?
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Post by andyhigham on Apr 15, 2019 21:13:23 GMT
The best beginners loco has to be the sweet pea. It is simple, tough, and reliable. It small enough to be man handled by one person yet powerful enough to haul a dozen or more passengers
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JonL
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WWSME (Wiltshire)
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Post by JonL on Apr 15, 2019 21:18:52 GMT
Everything I've seen suggests sweet pea to me, too. I've wished on a few occasions that I had gone down that route...
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dscott
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Post by dscott on Apr 15, 2019 22:40:27 GMT
The very best I ever saw was at the annual rally with the builder saying "That getting her into this state was the hardest and he even left her outside in all sorts of rain!" Yes you can finish and paint (or not) a Sweet Pea in any colour or livery and enjoy! Yes a great fan, you will get to know Jacqui Blackgates well, and they are the most relaxing of locomotives to drive. None turned up last Saturday so have withdrawal symptoms! Remember they love to be stuffed with coal constantly and keep the damper flap half open. Construction? Yes cut a length of plate, get 2 lengths of angle carefully rivet to each side and cut into 5 pieces? Yes we have just done all the frame stretchers!!!
Love David and Lily. I am trying to remember if I did meet Jack Butler the designer.
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smallbrother
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Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
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Post by smallbrother on Apr 18, 2019 11:45:25 GMT
Harry,
What skills, money and kit do you have?
If you have an abundance of all 3 you can tackle a much wider range than someone lacking in all 3.
Bit obvious but as I have found, some projects can exceed what someone is capable of.
Pete.
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Post by harryrobinson on Apr 19, 2019 18:00:41 GMT
Harry, What skills, money and kit do you have? If you have an abundance of all 3 you can tackle a much wider range than someone lacking in all 3. Bit obvious but as I have found, some projects can exceed what someone is capable of. Pete. At my local ME society we have a lathe and milling machine. The lathe I am fairly familiar with, and I often use, but I have not yet learnt to use the milling machine. As for money, I have relatively little, but I do have enough to afford all the castings (though I will be trying to find alternatives to buying castings when possible).
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smallbrother
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Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
Posts: 2,269
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Post by smallbrother on Apr 19, 2019 18:53:40 GMT
Harry, What skills, money and kit do you have? If you have an abundance of all 3 you can tackle a much wider range than someone lacking in all 3. Bit obvious but as I have found, some projects can exceed what someone is capable of. Pete. At my local ME society we have a lathe and milling machine. The lathe I am fairly familiar with, and I often use, but I have not yet learnt to use the milling machine. As for money, I have relatively little, but I do have enough to afford all the castings (though I will be trying to find alternatives to buying castings when possible). Hi Harry, Sounds like you are a bit further advanced than me when I started, which is good but not difficult! Don't forget the boiler - not very cheap whether you make it or buy one in. I am trying a Juliet. Cheapest castings as far as I could see and I got a commercial boiler for around 800. Lots of laser cut parts available too. Not a great puller though. Pete.
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JonL
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WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,906
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Post by JonL on Apr 19, 2019 19:15:09 GMT
I hate to sound like a stuck record but the sweet pea uses the minimum of castings, everything is huge and therefore less fiddly and when its finished it will pull a ton. I'd seriously investigate it further.
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Post by harryrobinson on Apr 19, 2019 21:02:23 GMT
I think I may take a look at the Sweet Pea. It looks like a nice engine. It seems like a lot of people know about them, there’s plenty of advice around. Blackgates also sells a book on building it, along with the drawings and castings. I once heard a tip “it’s better to build a smaller engine in a larger scale, than a large engine in a smaller scale”. I am definitely going to look into the Sweet Pea a lot more, I think it may be better for me than Mona.
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miken
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Post by miken on Apr 20, 2019 17:39:57 GMT
Years ago I learnt about miniature steam locos by driving a club members Sweet Pea that was fitted with a locomotive type boiler. It was powerful, easy to drive and fire and would run all day. On the other hand i have seen people struggling with Sweet Peas after an hour or so when they have the more commonly fitted marine boiler. Just saying. Was the loco boiler design published in EIM?
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Post by andyhigham on Apr 20, 2019 18:18:25 GMT
I have had no trouble running all day with the standard boiler, in fact on a long open track like Urmston it is hard to stop it blowing off all the way round
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Post by andyhigham on Apr 20, 2019 21:04:02 GMT
An advantage of the Sweet Pea boiler. If you have a fire problem like a clinker, you can pull the grate out, sort the fire and put it back in
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Post by Cro on Apr 21, 2019 6:39:46 GMT
Years ago I learnt about miniature steam locos by driving a club members Sweet Pea that was fitted with a locomotive type boiler. It was powerful, easy to drive and fire and would run all day. On the other hand i have seen people struggling with Sweet Peas after an hour or so when they have the more commonly fitted marine boiler. Just saying. Was the loco boiler design published in EIM? Mike was this loco called Planet X with a donkey pump fitted in the cab? The drawings were never published as far as I know but. I have a set along with a boiler to his design. Adam
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miken
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Post by miken on Apr 21, 2019 11:26:59 GMT
No, it was called Hayden.
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Post by danlank on Apr 21, 2019 21:54:21 GMT
No, it was called Hayden. And a fine loco it was too...
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Post by gingerneer on Apr 22, 2019 10:32:09 GMT
It really depends on what it is you want to do. Yes Sweatpeas are good, but it depends on how well made. Have a look a the Polly's. The basic 0-4-0 Is good not perfect, you can also order spare parts.
Will
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millman
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Post by millman on Apr 22, 2019 11:52:30 GMT
+1 for Pollys, I have one of the JGS Clarke 0-4-0 tender locos, it is in need of a strip down and repaint but it is a very reliable loco and has taught half a dozen people to drive, being a “kit” loco for the purchaser to complete means that it is made to a reasonable quality level whereas Sweet Pea could be a good one or a complete dog, don’t get me wrong the Pea is a good loco, I am nearing the end of building a pair of them, one an 0-4-0 and the other a 0-4-2 version and once I have one running the Polly will be in for repairs
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pault
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Post by pault on Apr 22, 2019 16:17:25 GMT
To me the most important thing is to build something you want, That way you stand of maintaining some enthusiasm. The skills required to build a good engine are the same to a large degree regardless of what the loco is
Something else to remember if your skills are limited is that a very small loco will be fairly feeble if it is say 30% down on power because the build is not all that it should be. A bigger loco even if it is down on power will still have a usefull amount of power
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miken
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Post by miken on Apr 22, 2019 19:07:37 GMT
Harry, So, you mentioned to me at the track today that you dont like the idea of axle pumps (im not very keen on them either). But when you steamed up Bessborough today you also discovered that injectors aren't keen on warm water either. This would clearly be a problem with a saddle tank like Sweet Pea. The simple solution is to have a separate water tank on your driving car to feed it with cold water. The more complicated solution is to build a tender. Incidentally I use Mr Paviers wonderful injectors on my locos, but even they get a bit temperamental on warm water which is why you saw me running round with my injector water valves open most of today, trying to get rid of the warm water so i could top up with cold in the station.
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Post by harryrobinson on Apr 23, 2019 6:18:47 GMT
Harry, So, you mentioned to me at the track today that you dont like the idea of axle pumps (im not very keen on them either). But when you steamed up Bessborough today you also discovered that injectors aren't keen on warm water either. This would clearly be a problem with a saddle tank like Sweet Pea. The simple solution is to have a separate water tank on your driving car to feed it with cold water. The more complicated solution is to build a tender. Incidentally I use Mr Paviers wonderful injectors on my locos, but even they get a bit temperamental on warm water which is why you saw me running round with my injector water valves open most of today, trying to get rid of the warm water so i could top up with cold in the station. I quite like the saddle tank design, and would like to keep it. If I was to put a few layers of cork or balsa sheet between the saddle tank and boiler, would that help?
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