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Post by houstonceng on Feb 17, 2008 21:52:34 GMT
Did you buy a pot of Easy-flo flux as well ? It won't work without that.
Well, actually it will - if you use Borax. But who keeps that in the supplies cabinet ?
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Post by AndrewP on Feb 17, 2008 23:14:38 GMT
Well, actually it will - if you use Borax. But who keeps that in the supplies cabinet ? Well I do, but I am a silversmith If you fancy a day out in the Lakes tbsteam, bring your bits with you and we'll do it together on my bench. Cheers, Andy
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SteveW
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,398
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Post by SteveW on Feb 17, 2008 23:25:20 GMT
TB,
One important point. If you have any soft solder contaminating a copper joint and then try to silver solder it you'll have big problems.
At silver soldering temperatures solder will alloy with copper and melt out a lower temperature and you'll get a hole.
Also remember that you need to get the joint up around/over 600C else it won't happen. A simple plumbers torch would be pushed on all but very small joints.
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Post by alanstepney on Feb 18, 2008 1:45:00 GMT
There are a few simple rules to silver soldering.
The first is cleanliness. The joints MUST be completely clean. Not just "wipe the muck off" but clean to the point of polished. In fact, after cleaning them, dont even touch them.
Then apply plenty of flux. Easyflo flux is supplied either as a white paste, or a powder that you mix with water to form a paste. It should be a fairly stiff paste, and needs surprisingly little water. Dont mix up too much at one time.
After thoroughly fluxing the joint(s) apply heat to the metal. Dont get the s/s in the flame or it will melt. You want the metal hot, and then apply the s/s, so that the heat of the metal melts the s/s. How hot? A dull-medium red.
The first thing that you will see is the flux bubbling, and turning black. Then clear. When it is hot enough, the s/s will start to melt as it is applied to the joint, and you will then see it "flash" round the joint by capilliary action.
To keep the s/s from where it isnt wanted, use Tippex. Not the water based one, the original stuff. Paint it on and it will act as a barrier to the s/s.
After it is finished, clean all the residue off. Let the soldered items cool, then plunge into water. The thermal shock will loosen must of the remaining flux. Oh, do that outdoors, and with the usual common sense safety precautions.
You can then use a weak acid to clean everything, but for a small simple boiler, a scrub using Vim or similar, will work OK.
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Post by stoney43 on Feb 18, 2008 8:04:10 GMT
hi Im in Hyde if you know where that is and wil be willing to give you a teach in if you can find us. Alternative is next Sunday im in bacup passing the station at rawtenstall and couldprobbably call in to see you. Dave.
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steam4ian
Elder Statesman
One good turn deserves another
Posts: 2,069
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Post by steam4ian on Feb 18, 2008 8:21:34 GMT
G'day all Dull red heat softens brass and copper. Don't make the mistake I made. I used a spring clamp to hold a cylinder to the face plate. When I took the job out of the quench I found I had an oval bored cylinder. Ouch Regards, Ian
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 18, 2008 10:13:41 GMT
I have done a bit of braising before but everything was supplied including a gas torch(not the hand held bottle)so i have a rough idea of what to do but i am thankful of all advise as i am a beginner.
The joints i need to solder are very small, it is just soldering the nipple onto the pipe.
I have got some flux, i can't remember whether it is a paste or powder but i will be ok with the flux as i have done it before.
Andy, i would love to but at the moment i can't drive(only turned 17 last monday) and i don't think i can get my dad to bring me up because he is always windsurfing.
Dave, I will let you know later on this week if thats ok as i will give it a go myself tomorrow hopefully when the rods arrive.
I will do it outside too rather than in my bedroom.lol.
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 18, 2008 10:47:54 GMT
Is there anybody who make blanking plugs???
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 19, 2008 11:25:49 GMT
Got the solder just now so i shall give it a go and see what happens. ;D
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 19, 2008 13:06:58 GMT
Ian was right.The nipple has started to melt but the silver solder wasn't melting. Anybody got any ideas before i go mad, or am i already there? ? And has anybody got a spare nipple to suit 3/16 pipe???
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steam4ian
Elder Statesman
One good turn deserves another
Posts: 2,069
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Post by steam4ian on Feb 19, 2008 20:26:22 GMT
G'day tb
Are you sure it is silver solder that you are using and not just a brass rod? A stick of silver solder will melt in the hot part of the flame of a small gas torch. The hot part is just beyond the inner blue tip, say 1/3 of the way out to the end of the flame. Put the end of the rod in this part of the flame and a ball should form at the end.
Have you done any reading on silver soldering etc?
Unless you are doing something way out with the steam ordinary soft solder will be satisfactory for joining pipe to nipples etc.
Regards, Ian
PS don't set your bedroom alight, it spoils your day.
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 19, 2008 22:36:17 GMT
I am definatley using silver solder. It was melting when i put it in the flame but it didn't melt when i put the solder on the joint and this has resulted in me losing a nipple because it started melting like you said in one of your previous posts.
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Post by AndrewP on Feb 19, 2008 23:00:30 GMT
TB It strikes me that access to a local ME Society would be really helpful to you - Rochdale is probably your closest. Contact details can be found in the listing on this forums 'mother' page:- www.modeleng.org/index.htmI haven't looked back since I found my local club.
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 19, 2008 23:10:07 GMT
I used to be a member but just didn't go there enough(maybe 3 times a year)but i have emailed them asking about it but have had no response.
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Post by Shawki Shlemon on Feb 20, 2008 7:36:23 GMT
Hi tb I have done hundreds of these down to 3/32 pipes successfully . the trick 1-very clean 2- Flux (correct flux for the siver solder) on pipe but not on end to prevent blocking the pipe . 3- use 45% silver solder (not any silver solder). 4- heat the pipe part first until flux run ,direct heat to the tail and touch the solder ,flash and that is that . 5-clean,check solder has run through ,check pipe not blocked (if so drill through) .
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Post by Shawki Shlemon on Feb 20, 2008 7:46:27 GMT
Hi tb It is me again , what type of blanking plugs you want? If female ones you are after, make them ,a pipe nut of the size you want ,turn a solid tail, put it in and peen over the end to keep it there .The male ones just a matter of turning and threading using a die .
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 20, 2008 8:30:00 GMT
I need male blanking plugs. I would make them myself but i haven't got a workbench at the moment so i need a company or someone who makes them.
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Post by alanstepney on Feb 20, 2008 10:08:05 GMT
I now that it is slightly "off topic", but if you can get hold of some of the early Model Engineers mags, there are many articles about making a "workshop" inside items of domestic furniture.
Back in the 40's and 50's, it wasnt uncommon for people to only have their flats/rooms/whatever and to keep domestic harmony, had to find a way of following their hobby without taking over the whole flat, and without a shed or garage.
Such items as old sideboards, cupboards etc can often be modifed to provide a complete "workshop" which can be shut away when work finishes.
In your situation, that might be an answer.
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 20, 2008 10:30:49 GMT
At the moment i don't have enough space but hopefully i can get a little bench set up in my old bedroom but i don't think i can do that yet.
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Post by modeng2000 on Feb 20, 2008 11:52:35 GMT
I also need some blanking plugs size 3/16" x 40 and spoke to Steam Fittings 01341-280637 www.steamfittings.co.uk/asp/index.asp Although they do not list them as stock he offered to make some for me and thought that they could be included in the range of fittings. Hope this helps, John
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