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Post by Ruston92 on Apr 15, 2014 7:46:35 GMT
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Post by ettingtonliam on Apr 15, 2014 8:10:45 GMT
Must try to get hold of some 'badmium silver' Maybe I should try a shop selling Unobtanium.
Richard
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Post by alanstepney on Apr 15, 2014 8:12:24 GMT
I wouldnt touch it with a bargepole!
I am not totally averse to duplex steel boilers, but pure (?) stainless is a worry.
That one has so many negatives against it that I would give it a miss.
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Post by marshall5 on Apr 15, 2014 8:35:39 GMT
Sounds like the guy has some sort of axe to grind. As I understand it the boiler is uncertifiable under our regs. I learned the hard way as a loco I purchased had stainless tubes and longitudinal stays which made the S.Fed.certificate with which it was sold "illegal". He might sell it to someone in a country like Germany or Japan where they don't seem to care about chloride cracking etc. There was some discussion on a U.S. forum recently and one comment seemed to infer that as one hadn't blown up yet stainless boilers must be O.K! Recent reports on a Duplex steel boiler which has now seen several year's use seem to be very encouraging. Just my 2p worth. Ray.
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davet
Seasoned Member
Posts: 139
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Post by davet on Apr 15, 2014 8:46:59 GMT
Some people must be interested, 13 bidders when I just looked the listing on eBay.
DaveT
Kuala Lumpur
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Post by ettingtonliam on Apr 15, 2014 8:53:36 GMT
Yes, 13 bidders, but look at the price. Stainless steel doorstops in the shape of a boiler make an interesting talking point, and that's about what its worth.
Do Bell Boilers really make these things?
Richard
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pault
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,496
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Post by pault on Apr 15, 2014 9:30:55 GMT
it looks to me like the tubes maybe silver soldered in
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Post by yorkshireman on Apr 15, 2014 10:33:35 GMT
There is however a very respectable company in Germany, that does produce proven Stainless Boilers! Please have a look hereThe number of boilers produced so far by Ehrle is substantial, and a boiler comes with all (God knows what) certificates. If such a boiler would be imported into the UK, the owner would have he right, under Eurepean Laws, to operate it over here, and any inspector would have difficulties to reject it. European Laws might overrule rules 'Made in England'. To get a loco with such boiler insured would be another matter, however, because an insurance is a free contractual matter between two parties. Regards Johannes |
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Post by Ruston92 on Apr 15, 2014 11:15:12 GMT
It does even look to have any stays in it though, nor does he mention what stainless grade it is. And if bell boilers have made it, why havent they tested it?
It could be a paper weight instead of a door stop.
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Post by ejparrott on Apr 15, 2014 11:16:00 GMT
Longitudinal stays but no firebox stays?
I wasn't aware Bell boilers were doing stainless boilers....
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Post by Ruston92 on Apr 15, 2014 11:25:40 GMT
Just read the questions people have asked about it. The seller seems very hot headed and short when people are questioning it. I feel he may have been diddled himself originally.
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jackrae
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,333
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Post by jackrae on Apr 15, 2014 12:33:41 GMT
As far as I'm aware, no-one has the "right" to operate on a UK club track unless the owner can satisfy the club inspectorate that they have suitable certification compliant with the terms of the club's insurance and even then the inspectorate still retains the right of veto.
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Post by yorkshireman on Apr 15, 2014 13:53:47 GMT
That is correct: The clubs have their house rules, but these are essentially set by the terms of the club's insurance. I know for a fact that some boiler inspectors would like to accept a stainless steel boiler if it is professionally made and has a perfect certificate - if they only could.
In industry though, eg a pharmazeutical company has every right to operate a stainless steel pressure vessel made to code valid within the EU. And the company would certainly fight for the right to use it...
I am sure someday there will be a conflict between, say, the German TUV and a UK Federation about the acceptability of a boiler with a TUV Certficate.
It is boilers like the one currently on offer that are the reasons of clubs and federations to disallow these.
Johannes
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2014 14:39:07 GMT
Hello all----------- this chap had another boiler or loco for sale not so long back and had the same dismissive attitude then towards the "little man in his garden shed".........IIRC he's in North London..... Those 13 bids could well be "Shill Bids" ( pages.ebay.com/help/policies/seller-shill-bidding.html )......EDIT}--- I have just spoken to BELL BOILERS (at ..https://plus.google.com/112320483704407597479/about?gl=uk&hl=en ) and they DO NOT make boilers less than 7.25 gauge and then only in plain Boiler-grade steel, NOT Stainless !! |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2014 14:43:26 GMT
Hello all----------- this chap had another boiler or loco for sale not so long back and had the same dismissive attitude then towards the "little man in his garden shed".........IIRC he's in North London..... Those 13 bids could well be "Shill Bids" ( pages.ebay.com/help/policies/seller-shill-bidding.html )...... North London?... 'it's not me guv'...honest, just in case anyone adds 2+2 and gets 5.......  Pete |
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Post by alanstepney on Apr 15, 2014 15:01:39 GMT
Irrespective of what any of us thinks, our insurers dont allow stainless steel for "our" boilers.
(Duplex steel is a different matter).
There might be exceptions and I assume it would be possible for an individual to arrange his own insurance, as I had to when I made a steel boiler long ago.
With that exception (if indeed it IS an exception) clubs are not allowed to accept stainless boilers if they want it to be covered by the clubs insurance.
Accordingly, anyone that buys it would be taking a chance not only on its condition, but also its acceptability for public use.
As I said earlier, not for me.
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Post by Roger on Apr 15, 2014 15:40:20 GMT
It looks like something he's knocked up himself before realising it's a turkey. Look at the marks just behind the front on the outside, what's going on there? Also, good luck with adding stays to that and making them steam tight.
From what I remember from my metallurgy classes, Stainless has to be chosen very carefully else it corrodes in the HAZ (Heat Affected Zone)
It really does make you wonder what some people are thinking of. The thermal conductivity of Stainless won't be anywhere near as good at Copper anyway, it's hard to see what benefits he's looking for.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2014 17:38:52 GMT
I suspect that he's afflicted with "Vertical, supple wrist--itus" !!
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Post by houstonceng on Apr 15, 2014 19:19:41 GMT
As a Chartered Engineer, I cannot understand how the "rhymes with banker" selling an illegal boiler can really be a professional engineer. Give the term Engineer a bad name.
I have never come across such an arrogant know all who knows nothing.
Anyone who buys it would never get a certificate from a S'Fed, N'fed, etc, affiliated club boiler inspector and I don't think any such club would be happy about him running it on their track.
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steam4ian
Elder Statesman
One good turn deserves another
Posts: 2,069
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Post by steam4ian on Apr 15, 2014 23:00:13 GMT
Just to confuse the issue are the what appear to be beautifully made boilers form H Erhle. These would be complete with all the CE makings etc. I can't read Deutsch enough to determine the grade of steel but the lustre make it not appear to be Duplex. There is some acceptance of Duplex as a boiler making material, see AMSBC Number 4, and the duplex steel I have seen has a grey lustre which is not how the H Erhle boilers appear. In previous discussions it appears the French had been making SS boilers for years using 316L. (316L is intended to have some Chloride resistance.) But then the French are frogs on the other side of the Channel. As for staying, the plate thickness required for steel significantly reduces the number of stays. A pilot Duplex boiler had no stays save one girder stay on the crown sheet. As for the HAZ, that is the principal fail point. Passivation can help. IMHO the real issue with any steel boiler, including SS and Duplex is maintenance. As you read through the troubling annals of accidents you will find it is not manufacture which is the problem but management and maintenance. Stainless steel boilers may be entirely satisfactory IF:- - List item 1
- List item 2
- List item 3
- List item 4
IMHO water treatment and management has not been fully resolved for Duplex boilers (may simply reflect that I have not heard the latest advice) As for the Vendor, he appears all that has been said here. However the question were very aggressive. Ian |
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