ModelWorks Likamobile

[steamer]

I am thinking about purchasing a kit from Model Works to make a Likamobile - a full-size early steam car (see their website for details) for £12k, over an eighteen-month period.

However, I am very concerned to read the pretty negative comments about Winston and Model Works kits on these pages, as well as the service received by writers in this chatroom

I'd really value even more comments from builders of their kits - both those who have had success and those that haven't, to try and form an opinion about whether I should spend a lot of dosh on something that may well never happen! I believe that the prototype has yet to be built. The ModelWorks pictures are of a car built by someone in Ireland.

Many thanks

Steamer

[Deleted]

I to saw the advert for the steam car, nice looking thing.
You say the first prototype has yet to be build, personally I would like to see the end result and certainly would like to see it working and test drive it. From what I read about them I would be very carefully it is a lot of money.
By the way at the previous Dorset happening there were several look alike cars were they all original or rebuilds? They certainly were a complicated piece of machinery not the thing you just bolt together in a no time.
Regards
Wilfried Vermeiren
users.skynet.be/modelbouw.wilfried

[greasemonkey]

Hi All
I dont have a Winson or Modelworks engine, but I've always found it strange that I have never seen Modelworks run one of their locomotive prototypes or control models on a track. To my knowledge they havent even run them at the Modelworks owners days. Can anybody confirm this? Ive seen the Rushton traction engine in steam but that was static and not moving.
Similarly Modelworks reguarly attend the Guildford show, surley this would be the perfect opportunity to demonstrate the ability of their products, but they haven't. Therefore I would be wary of spending large amounts on an unproven product!!!
As an aside wouldn't this require type approval, as all kit cars have to undergo? How would it stand with an MOT?

Andy

[alanstepney]

I dont have anything from Modelworks, (or Winsons, thank goodness).

However, I would advocate caution.
Extreme caution.
Especially with a new and unproven model.

It is a lot of money to spend, and perhaps lose, and I would want to be VERY sure of the product, any legalities such as roadworthiness, and the state of the company, before I parted with money.

[Phil Sutton]

I too would advocate caution.I have no axe to grind with modelworks,such dealings I have had with them have been fine,but having a winson loco has made me "once bitten twice shy."Certainly I agree with Alan's comments about seeing a working model and all the implied legalities therein.

Phil

[Tel]

12K??? From what I've heard of this mob you would be better buying 12p worth of nails & drivin' 'em into your various body parts - more fun & you save a heap of cash.

[Garry]

All I can say is BE VERY VERY CAREFUL. You might have read my notes on these pages regarding Modelworks if not please do so. The latest is the bodyshell for my A4 finally arrived after 18 months but without front end (they still cannot do it), and the parts I received were.................The panels were never like that on an A4 so I did ask for some material to make my own which they said they would send but after 5/6 weeks yet again nothing. I went to a Modelworks rally last year and would you believe the ONLY completed loco that would not work was Modelworks own. Does that prove a point? When I wrote to them and mentioned this they said they did not expect to run it, it was a last minute decision. If that was so why did they have the blower, oil, coal etc with them? I have seen about 6 Modelworks locos running including my own but NONE are as supplied all have been VERY heavily modified or rebuilt. I certainly would not touch them again, but the saying is "you pay your money and take your chance". If you give me your e mail address I can send you my report on the building of my loco.

[alanstepney]

Before spending many thousands of pounds with any company that is an unknown quantity, it is worth checking their accounts.
These should show whether or not the company is likely to be in business long enough to supply whatever it is you are paying for, and for long enough after that to solve any problems.

Even if you dont understand accounts, most people will know someone who does, who would be able to give them a look over.

All are public information and are available from Companies House,
www.companies-house.gov.uk/

If they are not up to date, or show losses, or zero profits, these are red flags that might make one think again about parting with cash.

[GeorgeRay]

However you need to know the company name exactly a trawl on model works as a name produced some interesting information but which is the company responsoble for the likamobile has to be guessed. You dont get the accounts free it will cost you at least £50. That of course is a small price to pay if you spend several thousand and dont get a sensible product at the end of it.

[Deleted]

Just to add a little more to this subject when Winson collapsed, those people who had paid for their monthly kits by credit card were able to claim their money back through the credit card company insurance scheme. Those who paid by cheque had no such return.
I have a part built Winson 5 inch gauge Pug which has given me a few problems but nothing major yet (only at kit 4 out of 12), and I have experienced a Winson/Modelworks A4 which only avoided the refuse skip because of the determination of it's builder. So as with the other contributors to this theme....Caution, and ask as many Modlework owners and builders as you can find.

Andy

[Deleted]

Looking at this lot Modelworks seem to have as much trouble building a model as me. Plus I don’t have novices building at home with no gear, no idea, and a flat pack mentality.

Surely no one thought you could build something as complicated as a live steam model without having problems. Just look at the returns desk in IKEA and all they are selling is a few bookcases, or derivatives thereof. By the thousand mind, world wide, Modelworks on the other hand are selling 25’s off.

Don’t buy if you think you won’t have problems, you will, it’s in the nature of the beast. If you do decide to buy use a credit card then your money is safe. Get some help sorted, places like these can be a start point if you don’t want to join a club.

Good luck.

[Garry]

I must disagree to some extent with the last entry as my loco cost more than a new Ford Fiesta but I would hope that Ford would not expect me to start having to machine the crankshaft and pistons etc to make it work which is what I have had to do with my loco. Another thing is IKEA parts are only upto a couple of hundred pounds, not thousands as are these locos but it seems the same people could be producing them if they have as many returns as you say. I can only add that I have never had much luck with Modelworks replying to my problems or even sorting them out. I think their advert forgot to mention fully equipped workshop needed to make the parts FIT AND WORK.

[alanstepney]

Modelworks specifically state that they make a product that can be assembled easily by a novice, using nothing more than hand tools.

THAT is what one buys.

If the actual outcome is a collection of parts that dont fit, have holes in the wrong places, and arent capable of being made into what they are supposed to be, even, in some cases, by an experienced engineer, then they, Modelworks, are failing to provide what they state.

Further more, in my opinion, any buyer receiving such kits, would have an excellent case if they took them to Court.

Now, any company that supplies anything that is not as stated, should concentrate on improving the existing range of products, not introduce more.
From comments here, and in many other places, it would appear that their quality control, and many other aspects of the business, leave a lot to be desired.

A shame really, as the concept is good, and there is an obvious need.

However, making and selling things that dont work is a sure way of discouraging potential model engineers, and causing many people much grief.

[Garry]

I have had the trading standards people involed and it is not as straight forward as it sounds. Firstly they asked if the parts could be assembled with hand tools, answer yes, whether it works is another matter. Take the pistons and cylinders for example, everything went together without difficulty so Modelworks were correct BUT only if the pistons were in the middle of the cylinders could you put it all together. All three pistons rods were too long so on front dead centre the pistons protruded from the cylinders so the covers would not fit. Also there was a gap of about 1mm around the piston rod and rear cover. This does not mean it would not fit BUT it would leak steam. The trading standards said these matters were a quality control problem so they could not get to involved. They said I should see a solicitor to start to take proceedings that way but if Modelworks thought it might cost them they would just fold up again and leave me with a solicitors bill. I cannot take that chance so I have to accept what I get and hope in time they will provide some good bits. Dont forget this company once said to me regarding the poor quality of my crank axle (it is tapered and oval) to quote "send yours back to us first so we can check it as we dont want to supply one that is similar" which tells me they have a lot of wrong ones in stock and cannot provide a correct one. It is not to easy to get things done unless everybody is willing to complain. I know of a few people who just make new bits because they can without too much trouble and others who are scared to complain in case they dont get anything again. I have been a victim of this throught this loco.

[alanstepney]

Garry,
In this case I can state catagorically that Trading Standards are wrong.

You are buying a locomotive, that comes in the form of a kit that "can be assembled easily with hand tools".

At the end of that assembly, you should have a working locomotive and not a static display model. If you wanted that, you could buy a plastic kit for much less.

Probabably the technicalities were too much for the local Trading Standards guys, but they do have higher authority to whom they can refer cases or potential cases, and that is what they should have done in this instance.
If you are still in contact with them, I suggest that you TELL them to do so.

As for the risks of legal action, if the judgement went against the company, the likely outcome would be for them to have to refund what you have paid, perhaps plus some nominal sum.
If the company, any company, is so weak that it cannot afford to pay out that much, it is in a sad and sorry state.
On the other hand, if you believe that the Directors might close the company rather than risk having a judgement entered against the company, then that says a lot about your opinion of them.

I dont agree with your idea of accepting whatever they deign to give you, but I can understand your reasoning.

Overall, I think that the posts here, and on other forums, show that the quality is not what one would expect.
Also, it appears that the response to complaints is less than satisfactory.

I certainly wont be patronising them !!!!

[Garry]

Alan, I know this thread was supposed to be about a kit called Likamobile but it seems most of the letters do go on about Modelworks and my experiences are on the thread named Modelworks (have you read some of my comments there?) but I do have a 12 page account regarding the problems (and a good point) about my loco and if any one wants to have a copy they are welcome to give me their address so I can forward it. I know I should not have to accept what they give me but if they send the wrong replacement parts or, as mostly it happens, they do not reply at all what can I do? I am not in a position to risk money on a court order etc. I wanted the A4 it has been my dream for 40 years or so. The only item that is going to give concern is the crank axle everything else has been modified or replaced because of no commitment from Modelworks. As I now have a running loco I am not prepared to strip it all down and try to remove the axle when there is no guarantee I will get a correct one. I could end up with one worse than what mine is now.

[alanstepney]

Garry,
Given the amount of work that you have done on that loco, it is debateable how much is still the original.

In that regard, and considering the time you have spent, I agree with what you say about taking legal action.