JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 4, 2020 16:01:17 GMT
Based on previous comments I think I'll look to an R8 spindle unless anyone thinks strongly I shouldn't.
Google is glowing red hot this end!
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jem
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Post by jem on Mar 4, 2020 16:31:24 GMT
Banggood do some very good tools, and not expensive, plus free postage from China, I have been very happy with tools that I have bought from them, though not sure how things will go at the moment with the virus! normal postage time is 6 weeks.
Jem
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Post by jon38r80 on Mar 4, 2020 22:23:17 GMT
I have similar experience with Aliexpress for tooling from China. More often than not It is often worth the wait
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 4, 2020 22:23:19 GMT
After an afternoon of poring over spreadsheets and reading reviews the Warco WM16 is currently favourite, only thing it doesn't have is the R8. I'm assuming from the happy users in here that isn't actually a deal breaker?
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 5, 2020 2:53:17 GMT
Reading Steve's post more thoroughly I've realised what I should have picked up on earlier...
"My own milling machine is an SP2217-III from SPG Tools but it is physically identical to the Warco WM-16, the Amadeal AMA25LV and the Chester 20V and all these machines have a 700mm x 180mm table."
Unlike the Warco the Amadeal / SPG is also available with the R8 spindle taper, and has a 1kw motor over the Warco 750w. However you do pay a bit more of a premium. If you go gear driven and the 750 watt motor rather than the belt driven 1000w suddenly you get an R8 spindle machine of a decent size for £950 (as opposed to £1,225 for the 1kw belt drive). The question is, is a belt drive worth the extra £275? Right now the SPG machines are looking very attractive. Sorry to keep blurting things out on here, I'm rather using this thread as a notepad/stream of thought!
Thanks for all the help, it is appreciated
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jasonb
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Post by jasonb on Mar 5, 2020 20:24:18 GMT
I don't think I ended up posting links to all the items used in the series of articles but this gives an idea of what you may eventually find you need, which was all inside the crate sent to me from ARC. Don't be put off you can do quite a lot with considerably less. If the SX3 is out of your budget then the cost difference between the SX2P and the SX2.7 is not so great and the SX2.7 works quite well. Also be aware that many of the suppliers of Weiss based machines (warco, spg, amadeal etc) may be quoting motor input, Sieg quote motor OUTPUT Belts or gears to give these variable speed machines two speed ranges can give more torque at lower revs particularly on the brushed DC motor ones, less of an issue with the more powerful brushless. Can be a pain changing between belt ratios and gears can add a lot of noise.
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dscott
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Post by dscott on Mar 5, 2020 23:45:52 GMT
After much research I got a WM 18 with an R8 spindle. You can take it apart and move it almost anywhere. You can set up frames and machine all the horns in one setting. A 6 inch vice can live one side of the table. Leaving the other side free for occasional set ups. Smaller vices set up at angles etc.
Also think of resale which is what someone else would desire! Many used machines tend to take ages on Gumtree etc.
My only problem so far was the lack of stops forward and back. But this was the first project I did once in position. Now I could not live without it. 5 holes tapped into the castings. My Dore Westbury has had one for many years. 5mm allen bolt heads all round drive you mad if you use any other size!!!
First day over 2 weeks I have not used it!!! Polishing shiny bits of Jessie.
David. And chief cleaner of the Mill, Lily.
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 6, 2020 14:30:57 GMT
I've had a few quiet night shifts; never a good thing as I end up sitting looking at reviews and manuals etc!
There are a couple of machines which keep leading the running, at the moment its the Seig SX2.7L. It just seems to tick a majority of the boxes and the aftersales looks superior. I suppose its quite a good thing that the front runners are, in my mind, quite closely matched.
Thanks for everyones input so far. My car finishes on ebay tonight so once money hits my account I'll look to pounce on a purchase, but we all know how long these things can take...
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Post by springcrocus on Mar 6, 2020 17:41:18 GMT
If you go for the Sieg, make sure it's the "L" variant. You would probably end up regretting it if you bought one of the shorter table versions.
Regards, Steve
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jasonb
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Post by jasonb on Mar 6, 2020 20:04:37 GMT
The main downside to the L versions is that the dovetails that support the longer table are no more bigger than the standard ones so they can be prone to sagging at full travel particularly if you are in the habbit of sticking the vice up one end and also hanging a power feed of that same end. Even one of the main Sieg suppliers would tend to talk customers out of a long table one.
Compared to my X3 table the one on the SX2.7 (standard table) that I also have in the workshop looks long and spindly
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Post by Roger on Mar 6, 2020 22:15:17 GMT
I've had a few quiet night shifts; never a good thing as I end up sitting looking at reviews and manuals etc! There are a couple of machines which keep leading the running, at the moment its the Seig SX2.7L. It just seems to tick a majority of the boxes and the aftersales looks superior. I suppose its quite a good thing that the front runners are, in my mind, quite closely matched. Thanks for everyones input so far. My car finishes on ebay tonight so once money hits my account I'll look to pounce on a purchase, but we all know how long these things can take... My only advice would be to buy as big a mill as you possibly can, (within reason). Mini mills are pretty flimsy and so are limited as to how quickly you can remove material. You might look at one with a view to converting it to CNC at a later date. Having to take a long time with lots of small cuts isn't as much of an issue if you don't have to stand over the machine while it's doing that. It's also worth looking at what you can do to beef it up with additional bracing. Some designs lend themselves to that more readily than others. Doug has significantly strengthened his Sieg mill, so it might be worth having a word with him.
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Post by coniston on Mar 6, 2020 22:19:28 GMT
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 7, 2020 14:30:55 GMT
All very helpful, thank you. The more I learn the more I understand what I do and don't want, so this is all very useful.
I do have floor space in the new workshop, but I don't really have the budget for a floor stander. I will construct a very sturdy stand for it though, cross braced to the walls.
As much as I like the X3, it's just out of my budget, as is the VMC. As with all these things I keep upping my budget slightly but I have to know where to set the limit, especially as I have to spend more money to make this into a workshop as it is!
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 7, 2020 14:33:09 GMT
....as well as the Harrison. That certainly looks like a lot of kit for the money!
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Post by jon38r80 on Mar 8, 2020 12:09:46 GMT
There is a quite nice looking My ford mill on here www.homeworkshop.org.uk/ for £1800 at the moment. Don’t know anything about Myfords and have avoided them like the plague as they always seem overpriced and ancient but others have different opinions and see them as the Holy Grail. It’s in Devon I think.
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 8, 2020 20:14:55 GMT
Sadly thats out of budget really, but I appreciate the assistance.
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 9, 2020 19:31:20 GMT
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/392710747845How brave do I feel? I'd never complain about it being too small or flimsy I guess... 3 phase inverter would be costly, as would the tooling... Still, I have to consider all the options.
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uuu
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Post by uuu on Mar 9, 2020 19:47:55 GMT
Looks like a fine machine. But it appears not to have a quill in the head (perhaps it's there but not obvious). If that is the case, then drilling would be a bit of a pain, as you'd have to wind up the knee for each hole.
Wilf
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JonL
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Post by JonL on Mar 9, 2020 22:17:09 GMT
Looks like a fine machine. But it appears not to have a quill in the head (perhaps it's there but not obvious). If that is the case, then drilling would be a bit of a pain, as you'd have to wind up the knee for each hole. Wilf Things a novice like myself would not have noticed, thank you. I'll follow it up. Also I've no idea what the taper would be on such a thing, I'm guessing an MT. EDIT - I don't suppose there is a way of assessing the wear on such an item either. It's a shame, I'd rather buy a used quality machine than a new entry level one.
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Post by coniston on Mar 9, 2020 23:09:43 GMT
That's the same model I had, a very sturdy machine with IIRC a combination of belt speed and gears for selecting speeds. It has 30 INT taper, so tooling is easily available ex industry. Wilf's right no quill feed but I didn't have a great problem, I guess I didn't do too much drilling in the mill. A rare to obtain quill feed head was an option. One problem I had was accessing the belt at the rear to change speeds, I left the cover off as I had mine against the side wall of the garage squeezed in between my lathe and a bench. Looks like it has the coolant feed up the LH side in tact which is good. You wont find a more rigid mill in this size, very capable machine. You'd need to check the motor is dual voltage if you want to fit a simple inverter otherwise you'd have to use a more expensive voltage converter (I think I'm right on that one) Check out here for more information - www.lathes.co.uk/harrisonmiller/page2.htmlChris D
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