|
|
Post by delaplume on Mar 2, 2021 16:13:52 GMT
Hello everyone...
In my capacity as Club Treasurer I was chatting with my Secretary the other day re}-- the Covic situation and the impact it's having on us ( Oswestry MES ) now and in the near future....We had just received the new Insurance details and he spotted something that I'd like your comments on, please......... Basically it would seem that if one Society pays a visit to another then we are all covered by the same policy.......but if I as an individual visit then there appears to have been a change in the cover and requirements compared to previous years.......
As we were talking on the phone at the time I wasn't able to record the actual paragraph / sentence applicable....... Maybe you fellow Club Officers know a bit more about this ??
Alan
|
|
stevep
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,070
|
Post by stevep on Mar 2, 2021 17:14:15 GMT
Our treasurer has been able, in the past, to issue me with a certificate that covered me as a member when visiting other societies, but under our club insurance.
|
|
|
|
Post by delaplume on Mar 3, 2021 13:55:02 GMT
Hi Steve----- yes, same here .......Each year I request a copy of our Club insurance cover and then present it to the Club I'm visiting, along with Boiler Certs. etc.........However, this has to do not only with Public hauling at that club but would appear to include the number of times that I visit it as well....
I'll get back to my Sec.--- seek further clarification --- and let you know what I find....
|
|
|
|
Post by Nigel Bennett on Mar 5, 2021 15:51:14 GMT
Our policy is changing to say that if a member visits another Society not as a club activity, then that member is covered only up to £1M, despite our Society being covered for more. They will only pay out a total of £2M for such individual member visits in one year. They go on to say that if individual members wish to take out extension policies to top up the figure to say £5M, they will cheerfully take their money; about thirty quid seems to be the going rate.
It does seem to me that there's a get-out clause; if as an individual member you agree with your own Society that it's an "official Society visit" - but with only one member turning up - surely then you should be covered up to your Society limit?
|
|
|
|
Post by delaplume on Mar 5, 2021 16:03:29 GMT
Our policy is changing to say that if a member visits another Society not as a club activity, then that member is covered only up to £1M, despite our Society being covered for more. They will only pay out a total of £2M for such individual member visits in one year. They go on to say that if individual members wish to take out extension policies to top up the figure to say £5M, they will cheerfully take their money; about thirty quid seems to be the going rate. It does seem to me that there's a get-out clause; if as an individual member you agree with your own Society that it's an "official Society visit" - but with only one member turning up - surely then you should be covered up to your Society limit? Yes, that was the sort of ting..........My Secretary mentioned it because I like to visit as many other Clubs as possible and expand my driving experiences....I think the problem area is to do with a visiting individual person driving fare-paying members of the Public at the host Club's track..............Maybe the idea of a 24Hr. membership for a nominal fee might work ?? |
|
cgd
Active Member
Posts: 26
|
Post by cgd on Mar 5, 2021 21:23:14 GMT
Reading through the various posts on this thread a number of things come to mind. I don't know whether my own Society's insurance is one of those that will be affected by the change in terms, but I will now be asking our Secretary.
Some initial thoughts:-
1) For some Societies a £1 million limit of indemnity may not be enough to meet the public-liability insurance requirements of the landlord, often specified in a lease. A requirement for at least £5 million PL cover by public sector landlords has been fairly common for some years.
2) Based on my relatively recent experience in handling PL insurance for a small-ish heritage operation, I think the Committee or other executive body of a Society should be asking themselves whether £1 million cover is adequate in any event (and that applies as much to their own PL insurance as to that of any visitor).
3)Regarding the "official visits" idea, leaving aside any other ramifications, I'd have thought that an insurer would want to see evidence (preferably written) of a formal invitation and acceptance between the "host Society" and the "visiting Society" for them to consider meeting a claim.
4) Whether the insurer would accept the "temporary membership" approach is another question, but a potential pitfall here is that the constitutions of many Society's (especially if a company limited by guarantee) require membership applications to be approved by the Committee/Board, which could make handling impromptu temporary memberships difficult even if they were otherwise acceptable (and I think that with regard to public passenger carrying there are many other factors to consider, especially having regard to the Guidance in HS2020).
All interesting food for thought and, no doubt, further discussion.
|
|
|
|
Post by Jock McFarlane on Mar 5, 2021 21:39:59 GMT
Reading through the various posts on this thread a number of things come to mind. I don't know whether my own Society's insurance is one of those that will be affected by the change in terms, but I will now be asking our Secretary. Some initial thoughts:- 1) For some Societies a £1 million limit of indemnity may not be enough to meet the public-liability insurance requirements of the landlord, often specified in a lease. A requirement for at least £5 million PL cover by public sector landlords has been fairly common for some years. 2) Based on my relatively recent experience in handling PL insurance for a small-ish heritage operation, I think the Committee or other executive body of a Society should be asking themselves whether £1 million cover is adequate in any event (and that applies as much to their own PL insurce as to that of any visitor). 3)Regarding the "offical visits" idea, leaving aside any other ramifications, I'd have thought that an insurer would want to see evidence (preferably written) of a formal invitation and acceptance between the "host Society" and the "visiting Society" for them to consider meeting a claim. 4) Whether the insurer would accept the "temporary membership" approach is another question, but a potential pitfall here is that the constitutions of many Society's (especially if a company limited by guarantee) require membership applications to be approved by the Committee/Board, which could make handling impromptu temporary memberships difficult even if they were otherwise acceptable (and I think that with regard to public passenger carrying there are many other factors to consider, especially having regard to the Guidance in HS2020). All interesting food for thought and, no doubt, further discussion. I think your post is spot-on. Points 1 and 2 are right. £1m is not enough if a catastrophe happens with life changing injuries. Points 3 and 4 are also right. In the event of a big claim any Insurer will be poring over the documentation to see how they can avoid a payout and contrived schemes like "day memberships" or "official visits by 1 person" will undoubtedly fail the test. The reality is you can get your own PL cover at £30 for £5m and I would guess £10m for not much more. That has to be the way to go and cheap if you make frequent visits to other railways. I would also guess that Clubs will now want to see evidence of proper levels of cover from visitors in excess of the £1m before you are allowed to run. JM |
|
|
|
Post by ejparrott on Mar 6, 2021 9:01:20 GMT
Our policy is changing to say that if a member visits another Society not as a club activity, then that member is covered only up to £1M, despite our Society being covered for more. They will only pay out a total of £2M for such individual member visits in one year. They go on to say that if individual members wish to take out extension policies to top up the figure to say £5M, they will cheerfully take their money; about thirty quid seems to be the going rate. It does seem to me that there's a get-out clause; if as an individual member you agree with your own Society that it's an "official Society visit" - but with only one member turning up - surely then you should be covered up to your Society limit? Yes, that was the sort of ting..........My Secretary mentioned it because I like to visit as many other Clubs as possible and expand my driving experiences....I think the problem area is to do with a visiting individual person driving fare-paying members of the Public at the host Club's track..............Maybe the idea of a 24Hr. membership for a nominal fee might work ?? I would not go to another track and haul fare-paying passengers. I am only familiar with our modes of operations, our rules and regulations, and our best practices. There is nothing to say another club operates in the same way. Equally, despite Model Engineer Magazine advertising otherwise, we do not have visiting drivers for our public running. |
|
|
|
Post by delaplume on Mar 15, 2021 13:17:20 GMT
Hello all,
Have just received the latest/newest ? ...newsletter from the Northern Federation and it contains a full explanation .......... Suggest you all have a good read....
How are things like IMLEC and "Open" days covered ??
Alan
|
|
