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Post by Shawki Shlemon on Jan 7, 2023 6:16:13 GMT
What are we comparing it to when saying hobby got expensive ? are we comparing it to 10-20 years ago , dollar to dollar or are we comparing it to other things or hobbies . in my opinion to the cost of living is more or less the same as always have been . For example a loaf of bread in early 70s was 12 cents now is $5.00 .
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Post by Jim on Jan 7, 2023 6:40:00 GMT
I would agree Shawki. I enjoy model engineering for the peace of mind it gives me along with the satisfaction of creating a working miniature of something that has always fascinated me such as steam locomotives and traction engines. Cost? for a young family person with young children the priorities are for their care and education along with paying off the home ahead of a lathe or mill. For me the cost in setting up the hobby is an investment in my health and well being along with the hope that my models will survive long after I've shuffled off the planet.
Jim
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Post by steamer5 on Jan 7, 2023 7:11:58 GMT
I like Ross's idea! The casting i brought for K1 (21 years ago) are now down to $1.10 a week!
years ago one of the guys in the club wrote an article for our club mag on this topic, comparing various sports with model engineering..... we came out ahead! Now if you want a hobby that has a black hole to throw money into take up something to do with car modification! My son has had a couple of goes at this, & hasnt learnt his on his next project car.... the chance of breaking even are slim, making money even slimer! My son in law is also doing this.... he sat down a couple of years back & totaled up what he had spent that year........GLUP!!
Cheers Kerrin
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Post by simplyloco on Jan 7, 2023 8:52:29 GMT
I like Ross's idea! The casting i brought for K1 (21 years ago) are now down to $1.10 a week! years ago one of the guys in the club wrote an article for our club mag on this topic, comparing various sports with model engineering..... we came out ahead! Now if you want a hobby that has a black hole to throw money into take up something to do with car modification! My son has had a couple of goes at this, & hasnt learnt his on his next project car.... the chance of breaking even are slim, making money even slimer! My son in law is also doing this.... he sat down a couple of years back & totaled up what he had spent that year........GLUP!! Cheers Kerrin Agreed. I owned a 911 for just one year and I could have bought two boilers for what it cost me!
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firebird
Seasoned Member
Conway now up and running
Posts: 149
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Post by firebird on Jan 7, 2023 9:26:52 GMT
Hi
As a quick example about 10 years ago I bought my X3 milling machine for £600.00. It took me a few weeks of back and forth until I decided I could just about justify the purchase so went ahead and bought one. Todays price is £1800.00 which would put it way out of my reach. Even taking inflation and wage increases into account there is no way I could afford to buy one today.
Cheers
Rich
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Post by melaser on Jan 8, 2023 11:51:02 GMT
Shipping Hi Ed, Yes, shipping is a constant problem for me too. Books are quite bulky but the price is not so high. As a result, the shipping gets to be quite a big part of the price. For three years now, I have used www.parcel2go.com/quick-quote For using ParcelForce, it is cheaper than going into the post office. However, most of the time I use Evri as they are cheaper. In the run-up to Christmas when the Royal Mail were unreliable, I switched everything, even £2.99 books to Evri. They got every single one to the destination before the big day. What is more amazing is that they were totally overwhelmed because almost every other small business was doing the same as me!! I had several emails telling me that Evri were hopeless, but my experience has been very good. Yes, they do occasionally lose things, but I usually get the shipping cost back. Maybe worth a try for you? Chris. I use DHL via Parcelhub, and also used Evri before Christmas since Royal Fail weren't working, they lost 2 out of 18 parcels, only 6 were delivered in 48 hours, most took 6 working days. The Post Office is usually cheaper than Parcelforce, plus they get a commission, and if we don't use them, we'll loose them, and all the other services they offer.
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Post by David on Jan 8, 2023 23:49:24 GMT
As a quick example about 10 years ago I bought my X3 milling machine for £600.00. It took me a few weeks of back and forth until I decided I could just about justify the purchase so went ahead and bought one. Todays price is £1800.00 which would put it way out of my reach. Even taking inflation and wage increases into account there is no way I could afford to buy one today. That's a big increase. I just checked the one I bought, 11 years ago. The same model from the same shop has gone from $1800 to $2850, so not quite as bad a rise. But still quite a bit. That's the base single phase model with no DRO or quill digital readout. I cannot recall the cost of the lathe but it was over $3000. It is now $5820. I would struggle to justify buying those machines now so I'm really glad I have them already and perhaps I should start taking proper care of them! It's not a question of whether model engineering is an expensive hobby relative to anything else, it's just a question of who can afford any of these hobbies? People spend astronomical amounts on cars (especially racing cars) and bikes and I'm guessing it's not cheap to set up a wood working shop. Guitars and amps are silly money these days. Boats - lot of maintenance costs there. Perhaps the clue is to get in the machines before you have too much family or debt. I wouldn't know where to buy 2nd hand machines down here. I have all the machinery I'd ever need to build anything from metal. I just can't afford the metal anymore :-\
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Post by suctionhose on Jan 9, 2023 1:45:26 GMT
Here's a theory:
People's value system has shifted. Not voluntarily either. You would have to be tough to resist the marketing insisting you can't live another minute without the latest gizmo or latest version of the gizmo. Who would deprive their children of new wireless earbuds at Christmas? (After they lost the previous ones and the ones before that... but that doesn't matter because they were old anyway...)
I know people who have gone off grid to a shed out of town to avoid it. They assure me you can live comfortably very cheaply. I know it's true but I'm Mr Negative, the stick-in-the-mud that routinely opposes new purchases... For the others, there's nothing to look forward to unless a new purchase is on it way. Keeps them happy. Never mind more plastic. More packaging. Who said "Our generation's got a Planet to save"? (I was told that yesterday)
The things at home that are most treasured are the things that cost the most. This is the value system. Expensive = Good. Things I make, because making is comparatively inexpensive, are not valued by average people because they didn't cost a bomb.
Example: We have a beautiful piece of jewellery that cost the same as the traction engine. We sourced the diamond ourselves - perfectly cut in Europe a real beauty - and had the setting made. Now diamonds aren't rare - billions of women have more than one of them - but they are hard to cut and special if cut well. It might take a few days for cutting.
The setting took 6 hours. The jeweller told me! So here you have a 'precious possession' that took 3-4 days to make with the same perceived value as something that took me 5000 hours to make - something that actually IS THE ONLY ONE OF ITS KIND IN THE WORLD! How does that work??? Marketing!
The moral is, don't let others tell you the value of your hobby. We aren't good at marketing ourselves and converting a good engine to school fees doesn't last long enough for anyone to remember.
Men: if you want it - go get it! Life is too short...
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Post by David on Jan 9, 2023 4:19:15 GMT
Who would deprive their children of new wireless earbuds at Christmas? I would, and did. Lucky thing too, because the child that wanted them then managed to break the screen on the Chromebook they need for school so now I have to buy a new one of them. I'm certain it was an accident rather than malice. They're also complaining about the 720p TV we got off the in-laws about 10 years ago. Still waiting for the in-laws to upgrade their current TV!
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lesstoneuk
Part of the e-furniture
Retired Omnibus navigation & velocity adjustment technician
Posts: 373
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Post by lesstoneuk on Jan 9, 2023 5:11:11 GMT
Men: if you want it - go get it! Life is too short...[/quote]
I agree, after covid took me too close to Hades for comfort, I looked at things I've wanted to do but haven't. A locomotive had been a desire for mamy many years. Now, I'm a short way from completing my first.... Excitement.... Yes Scared of effing up on the first run.... Yes
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Post by Jo on Jan 9, 2023 7:25:53 GMT
Men: if you want it - go get it! Life is too short... I can confirm that this woman did just that Us Ladies have a terms for it SABLE - Stash Acquisition Beyond Anticipated Life Expectancy. To finish all the stuff I have in my Stash I need to live until at least 200 Jo
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Post by steamer5 on Jan 9, 2023 8:00:13 GMT
Hey Jo, Are you taking into account of the yet to acquire casting? It’s a long time until you get to 200, there must be more sets that need your expert touch!
Cheers Kerrin
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Post by Jo on Jan 9, 2023 8:19:25 GMT
Hey Jo, Are you taking into account of the yet to acquire casting? It’s a long time until you get to 200, there must be more sets that need your expert touch! There is always the odd casting set that needs to be provided with a loving new home Thankfully not having an expensive other half in toe I have no one to look horrified at the cost of the desirable item that I am acquiring. Jo
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Post by ilvaporista on Jan 9, 2023 8:39:14 GMT
Men: if you want it - go get it! Life is too short... I can confirm that this woman did just that Us Ladies have a terms for it SABLE - Stash Acquisition Beyond Anticipated Life Expectancy. To finish all the stuff I have in my Stash I need to live until at least 200 Jo Based on my latest rate of progress I have enough stashed away for a millennium! But I do agree, build up stocks for future projects whilst you are able. That also means having a place to store everything.
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Neale
Part of the e-furniture
5" Black 5 just started
Posts: 279
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Post by Neale on Jan 9, 2023 11:42:08 GMT
A lot of model engineers I have met could always fall back on those Quorn castings they have had sitting under the bench for the last 30 years... And once you have done that, you can save money by sharpening old cutters yourself instead of buying new! If only I would take my own advice
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Post by mugbuilder on Jan 12, 2023 0:02:56 GMT
Model engineering is not an overly expensive hobby compared to many others. Machinery has never been so cheap since the Chinese entered the market. It may not be as good as some European or British makes but it does the job. Good work can be done on old equipment it is very worn but still does what I need it to do. My larger Chinese lathe is now old and isn't equipped with any fancy DRO equipment but I have `built many engines with it. The hard part of the hobby is getting started with a basic setup. Once that has been achieved add tools a little at a time and look after them. I am using some of my dad's tools that are nearly 90 years old. I have heard many modellers complaining about the cost of materials and yet buy a new car every few years that loses its value at an alarming rate. That doesn't seem to bother them. A good model will always be worth more than it cost to build and the builder will get many hours of satisfaction from it.
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Post by runner42 on Jan 12, 2023 0:41:31 GMT
I have not read all the previous inputs so I may be repeating what has already been said. These projects tend to cover many years so if the costs are amortised over this time period then it doesn't hurt the hip pocket so baldly.
Buy materials as and when they are needled.
Brian
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lesstoneuk
Part of the e-furniture
Retired Omnibus navigation & velocity adjustment technician
Posts: 373
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Post by lesstoneuk on Jan 12, 2023 6:31:47 GMT
I have not read all the previous inputs so I may be repeating what has already been said. These projects tend to cover many years so if the costs are amortised over this time period then it doesn't hurt the hip pocket so baldly. Buy materials as and when they are needled. Brian This was one of the reasons I opted for electric. There is no way I'd get the cost of a boiler past her ladyship. Now £10 here, £30 there is acceptable. Being on a pension also keens the mind on obtaining things. Chinese stuff is hit and miss... Some things are of superb quality yet other stuff makes British Leyland look like quality manufacturers. Several times I've looked for an item, had no luck whatsoever, yet alter the description slightly and found a plethora of suitable things. I think that's half the fun of the chase. I have a big expense coming up, a 100 size leisure battery, if I'm lucky it'll be £60,if I'm very lucky, high 50s.
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Post by simon6200 on Jan 12, 2023 21:21:36 GMT
I’ve been driving for 50 years. I have spent a total of $A30,000 on all the cars I have owned. Six vehicles in total, all station wagons. I have never had reliability problems. The money I have not spent on cars means I could easily afford machinery and stock and I have everything I need.
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Post by andrewtoplis on Jan 12, 2023 22:29:27 GMT
I think it is the headline cost of steam locos that would give the perception. The well known websites are full of 5" pacifics for £5-8000, which would buy you a decent car that feels a lot more for your money! This must feel like a hobby with a high barrier to entry, needing either an expensive engine or an expensive workshop - perhaps we should be singing the praises of our clubs, ours has a full workshop available for use, and the annual fee is peanuts really.
Speaking personally, my main issue is time, which runs at between 0-4 hours per week, I'm sure some of you have beaten my monthly output before your first tea break!
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