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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 11:35:09 GMT
Blood ??----------- I thought an Engineering Gentleman ( like wot u is ) would have DOT4 in them thar veins, me derio ??...Yes, you take care of you first, which will mean doing as SWMBO says I suspect ??.........
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 3, 2014 18:32:13 GMT
in the interests of those who do things the old fashioned way ive cut a 16" x 2 7/8" length of 1/16" steel sheet up to roll for the smokebox, being rather pleased that my hacksaw with the blade turned 90 degrees would accommodate the 2 7/8" width. the length i need is 13.54" so will roll the whole lot in my rollers and use the excess for a doubling plate on the bottom.
a nice 10 min diversion from doing boiler fittings!
i could have taken the sheet along to a local engineering firm and got them to guillotine it for me for a fiver, but what the heck! i would have spent more than 10 mins in the car driving there and back!
cheers,
julian
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Post by Shawki Shlemon on Sept 4, 2014 10:27:47 GMT
Julian sorry to what happened to you , take care in the future , we all tend to like to go to the workshop even when shouldn't , on those days I try to do something , I do planning for the next job or study the plans , things that are sort of productive but not fiscal . After all it is a hobby and not real work .
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 5, 2014 22:02:16 GMT
ive made a bit more progress on the smokebox. my homemade rollers (an old 5"g buffer beam plus 3 old axles) eventually managed to roll the steel strip i'd cut up. it was then placed in the bench vice between two lengths of angle and thermalite blocks and pieces packed around then the joint silver soldered. hopefully the following pics show what i did. cheers, julian      |
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Post by Roger on Sept 5, 2014 22:29:13 GMT
That's such a neat job Julian, I would struggle to make it stay precisely together to Silver Solder it. How did you do that?
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 5, 2014 22:39:31 GMT
hi roger,
that's very kind of you.
if you look at the last 2 pics you can just see one of the bits of angle either side of the bench vice jaws clamping the smokebox wrapper together for silver soldering. it was quite a good spring fit together anyway. when i first used this method some years ago i was a bit worried that the heat would cause the joint to move or open up, but this has proved not to be the case and the silver soldered joint is 'spot on'.
i left the silver soldered assembly in the vice to cool down and 'normalise' afterwards, and chipped off the flux rather than dunk in pickle.
cheers,
julian
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Post by Roger on Sept 6, 2014 7:30:52 GMT
Ah yes, I can see them now. I'm still surprised that it's enough, but it obviously is. That's one to remember for later one.
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Post by Shawki Shlemon on Sept 6, 2014 9:31:56 GMT
Nice job there , I have done few before but I wasn't as clever as you , I held it in place by small plates inside with loose rivets and filed the rivets off later leaving two small brackets inside .
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Post by Roger on Sept 6, 2014 17:26:45 GMT
Another quick question Julian. Rollers don't roll the material right to the end, but by eye, I'd say your's looks curved right up to the edge. Do you have any tips on how best to do that?
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shooter
Part of the e-furniture
If it 'aint broke....don't fix it!
Posts: 252
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Post by shooter on Sept 6, 2014 21:27:49 GMT
Nice work Julian, as always. Lovely to see someone with as untidy a bench as mine. Makes me feel a whole lot better. Hope your back and finger are improving!
Roger, I found when rolling my smokebox that by starting from either end in turn I end up with a perfect round as the rolls miss the very end of the workpiece. Starting alternate ends makes sure nothing gets missed. Hope that makes sense?
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Post by Roger on Sept 6, 2014 22:15:15 GMT
Thanks, yes that makes sense. I haven't done that much sheet metal work, I try to avoid it really because I don't enjoy it. I guess I'm going to have to get to like it.
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 7, 2014 9:30:13 GMT
hi roger,
my homemade rollers do indeed leave a flat portion each end, so the ends were dressed on a lump of 2 3/4" dia steel with a hammer.
cheers,
julian
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Post by Roger on Sept 7, 2014 9:57:22 GMT
Ah, my memory didn't desert me then, I thought the rollers couldn't take it right to the very end.
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 8, 2014 21:51:45 GMT
after spending an inordinate amount of time doing the water gauges (on the 'scale' boiler fittings thread) i seem to have made rapid progress on the smokebox. anyway a few pics. the rear ring (brass) is an old stand for something, and needed an extra bit of steel strip rolled for the rear of the smokebox as wasnt quite the full diameter. similarly the front ring (an old disc of cast iron) wasnt quite the full diameter and required an extra ring of steel strip rolled that can just be seen. cheers, julian    |
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 8, 2014 22:09:34 GMT
incidentally ive been doing a bit of work and calculations on the smokebox arrangement. the original BOXHILL drawings dont comply with the well known Greenly formula which is very well tried and accepted, nor does it comply with brian hughes' excellent formula that ive used (with excellent results) for very many years (ME 1966 and updated ME 2 Nov 1979). the long chimney provides excellent draughting if everything else is properly designed - unfortunately the BOXHILL drawings show the blast pipe nozzle far too high relative to the petticoat pipe choke, a blast nozzle at 5/32" that i would be ashamed of (i will start with 3/16" dia though i opened out all the exhaust passages when compared to the original design), plus the internal diameter of the petticoat pipe (the 'choke') is far too large at 7/8" dia, 11/16" to 3/4" dia being far more suitable as per the brian hughes formula.
in assessing the above i am lucky to have a few locos of similar grate size for comparison. in such circumstances one quickly gets a feel for such things.
cheers,
julian
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jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,922
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Post by jma1009 on Sept 11, 2014 22:19:14 GMT
here's a couple of pics of the smokebox door - made out of an old gunmetal casting once attached to something else. smokebox doors often have quite complex curves (the A1X terrier doors being quite distinctive) , plus all machining marks must be removed before painting as otherwise they show up very badly. the second pic is after a bit of fettling with a file. the smokebox door is soft soldered to a brass mandrel for turning the profile etc. gunmetal chippings all over the workshop and house! cheers, julian   |
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dscott
Elder Statesman
Posts: 2,440
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Post by dscott on Sept 11, 2014 22:34:09 GMT
Oh to return to mine!!! Yes your door looks lovely and you are right about the turning marks showing up especially in the sun. Mine is a cylinder out job to proceed!
I spent the day digging out a bank of earth for the workshop extended bit. I am doing the roof as fast as I can before the next rainy season!!!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2014 7:55:39 GMT
Her beautiful lines are beginning to show Julian...what a pretty loco you are building there... first class sir...
Pete
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Post by Roger on Sept 12, 2014 18:41:17 GMT
Is there a particular reason why steel isn't used for the door? That's what I was going to use for SPEEDY.
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Post by ronhancock on Sept 12, 2014 19:02:49 GMT
a successful 10-15mins heating up and silver soldering of the L-H firebox side stays, L-H foundation ring, and blowdown bush, plus touching up the corner of the front L-H front foundation ring i'd missed last weekend. ive added quite a few pics coz the method of doing firebox stays with propane hasnt been very well covered in ME, and to show it is quite easy to do with propane. you do have to leave off the inner firebox doorplate though. in fact as STEPNEY's firebox is quite small i think it would be quite difficult to do with oxy-acetylene with the inner firebox doorplate in position. anyway the pics... note the chamfer on the outside of the firebox wrapper around the stay holes on the outside and the tapered ends of the 1/8" dia copper rivets used as stays. note the rings of silver solder hard up against the inner wrapper side in the water space. they are tight fitting so preventing the stays moving plus preventing the rings moving. just a bit of crimping with a pair of pliers to get the tight fit. flux everywhere inside and out and in the water space. heated up initially inside the firebox with the tubes covered with thermalite to protect them and the throatplate stays. after 10 mins each stay in turn moving deeper into the box has a flash of silver solder appear around the stay heads. then a change to outside and play the torch on the foundation ring side plus that corner i'd missed, adding silverflo 55. then to the outside of the wrapper running a long length of silver solder rod along each row of stays in turn. there is a pic of the inside of the water space showing how it all penetrates cheers, julian            |
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