|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 20, 2013 0:58:47 GMT
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 20, 2013 16:45:38 GMT
I didn't know how I was going to do the 1-1/8" hole in the barrel for the steam dome until I saw an ugly old plumber's reamer in the back of the shop cupboard ... it was worth a try! It worked and did a reasonable job as well so that is the last of the parts needed before soldering the boiler and doing the initial hydrostatic test. Now, if my rotary table would arrive so I could radius the tops of the end plates before soldering ....
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2013 16:53:07 GMT
nice work Dianne... the boiler is coming on in leaps and bounds.. love the reamer... made for the job... Pete
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 20, 2013 17:04:44 GMT
Thank you Pete! Appreciate the comment.
I found that reamer at a used tool store ages ago. It is old, ugly, beat-up, and must weight 10 pounds. I never expected it to earn the $5 I paid for it (except as a paper weight) LOL!
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2013 18:28:41 GMT
Hi DIANNE------- just loving that reamer !!..It goes to show that one mans' tat is another wo(mans') useful bit'o kit !! ..........From a current thread, what plans do you have for lubrication ?? ( My "Tallow" joke might now be actually appropriate for this loco, maybe ??)........PS}--- If your house chimney Diameter is smaller than the hoped-for Rotary table then Santa will have to "Re-appraise the situation" methinks.........
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 20, 2013 19:47:09 GMT
Yes, that reamer is 'something else' I was just reading that Trevithick used "water and graphite" at one point after 1803 but there is no indication what he may have used on the Coalbrookdale engine (if anything) I plan to use a small displacement lubricator tapped into the steam passage between the throttle and the valve.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2013 21:15:27 GMT
I didn't know how I was going to do the 1-1/8" hole in the barrel for the steam dome until I saw an ugly old plumber's reamer in the back of the shop cupboard ... it was worth a try! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reminded me of the KIA-ORA drink birds >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Attachments:
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 20, 2013 21:20:17 GMT
ROFLMAO!!!!
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2013 22:14:40 GMT
OK, but only because you say so --- LoL !!
|
|
jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,913
|
Post by jma1009 on Dec 20, 2013 23:23:54 GMT
hi dianne,
i thought originally you were going to set the 1/4" thick endplates into the barrel and silver solder. now they are trepanned and effectively form little more than a butt joint, and once the first one is done the second one cant be checked for proper penetration of the silver solder. a fillet around the outside doesnt guarantee strength where it is needed on the inside.
i dont like this at all im afraid. the workmanship is superb, but the design relies totally on correct silver soldering - one joint of which cant be inspected properly once done and not a very generous joint either.
i think you also also ought to add a stiffner plate to the barrel/dome joint. the barrel is the most crucial part of the boiler.
i am sure others may have a different view!
cheers, julian
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 21, 2013 1:45:38 GMT
With a 1-5/8 flue hole in both end plates it will be quite easy to inspect the inside of both solder joints prior to installing the flue.
Your opinion is noted.
|
|
jma1009
Elder Statesman
Posts: 5,913
|
Post by jma1009 on Dec 21, 2013 2:09:01 GMT
and when you silver solder in the flues how will you know that the main structural joints on the end plates havent been affected? bearing in mind that to silver solder the flues you have quite a mass of copper to heat up in close proximity to those structural endplate joints? plus a whacking great big bush to silver solder on one end for the cylinder. i was expecting you to silver solder everything up in one go. hmm...
|
|
steam4ian
Elder Statesman
One good turn deserves another
Posts: 2,069
|
Post by steam4ian on Dec 21, 2013 2:37:50 GMT
Dianne.
Julian's concerns can be answered by putting a couple of bushes in the shell or endplate large enough to get a cheap boroscope through.
Go to you local electronic gadget/hobby store or even motor parts suppliers. I have one which plugs by USB into my laptop and gets great picture and only needs a 1/4" hole.
You can also use different temperature silver solders.
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 21, 2013 2:58:10 GMT
I will have a 3/4" hole in the rear end plate where the cylinder bolts on so there's no problem getting a borescope in. There isn't much other 'available space' on the ends.
Since I will be able to inspect the inside after soldering, maybe I WILL have a go at doing it all in one shot. That would save a lot of heating fuel.
|
|
|
Post by runner42 on Dec 21, 2013 5:56:34 GMT
Hi Dianne, I have been following your log with interest. Perhaps what you intended at the outset was only to show M.E.C.H. " hey guys this is what I am up to". But you have on occasions come under scrutiny and had to justify your design decisions, so I don't want to add to this and stretch you patience further, especially when I am no expert. I don't know what the Canadian rules and regulations are but I assume that a boiler inspector will be required to certify the boiler as safe. The question is at what point does he/she become involved and how will it be inspected? I would have thought that the boiler inspector would need to inspect the plates/parts prior to silver soldering, to see there are no weak points in the parts. Maximum metal condition and all that. The use of a borescope if that method is what he/she is happy with can pre-empt the need for stage inspections if your intend to silver solder it all in one go. But a word to the wise, in silver soldering the tubes I assume from the outside you need to engineer flow paths to ensure the silver solder gets behind the plate and provides a fillet both sides. ( I can hear you say geeze tell me something I don't know). Finally, draw up a plan for how you are going to do it. What joint first, second etc and visualise how you are going to do it. It's a reasonable size boiler so you will be generating some heat all in one go, it's good that it's winter time in your neck of the woods.
Best regards,
Brian
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 21, 2013 10:33:34 GMT
Actually I have been consulting with a number of people all through the process including a few experienced model boiler makers and professional engineers. It isn't that I am unfamiliar with boilers but rather that this is the SMALLEST boiler I have ever made and the first copper boiler. I was one of the founding members of a provincial association for the preservation and operation of historic boilers (full size) and served as Technical Chairman for many years working with the government regulatory agency on inspection, testing, and repair of boilers and establishing 'historic boiler code' in compliance with ASME and National standards. My background in full-sized steam engines goes back over 40 years as does my career in engineering and design in a professional capacity. I have been one of the "go-to people" for boiler construction, inspection, and repair in the full-size field for a long time.
Questions such as "How are you going to inspect the inside for proper penetration?" are valid and helpful and I appreciate people making sure I have considered various things. Comments like "I don't like it." are not in the least helpful. Frankly I don't give a s##t what one person or another dislikes - the design is solid and WAY beyond minimum safety standards and I will not respond to any such comments. If they continue, I will simply not bother updating this thread in the future.
|
|
|
Post by Rex Hanman on Dec 21, 2013 11:09:26 GMT
Great response Dianne! Good luck to you, please keep posting!
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2013 11:10:51 GMT
Well said !!----------"I like the cut 'o yer jib, so I do" -------- but PLEASE do continue with this blog ??----------- Here's some inspiration for you I hope, penned by some "Baldy bloke" a few years ago}----------- To be, or not to be, that is the question— Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune, Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles, And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep— No more; and by a sleep, to say we end The Heart-ache, and the thousand Natural shocks That Flesh is heir to?..................................See what I mean ?? ...."Up an attem, kiddo !!) !!
|
|
|
Post by wdiannes on Dec 21, 2013 12:08:25 GMT
Hummmm ..... Since the circumferential joints and central stay provide more than enough support for the end plates it might be a whole lot easier to simply roll the tubes in place rather than silver solder them. The force on the tubes is "crush" rather than longitudinal so using the tubes for support isn't necessary. It would make inspection after silver soldering very easy and would allow simple tube replacement years down the road. It also makes assembly much more simple.
I have often rolled steel tubes in a sheet sheet but not copper in copper. Does it work?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2013 12:15:12 GMT
--------- by rolled I take it you mean "Expanded" ??......... not sure if copper would take kindly to that during operational use ??
|
|