How to turn a Forum thread into hard cash!

[simplyloco]

I was sitting in the Croatian sunshine last Spring, musing on how I could generate some more beer/wine money. While building the poppet valve regulator for the Brit I included a piece on Button Boring - an old fashioned toolmakers technique - so I lifted that bit and sent it - virtually untouched-  to Neil Wyatt, the MEW Editor. I looked into my bank account this morning to find £100! Better late than never...

For newcomers interested in this sort of thing the link to the original thread is here:

modeleng.proboards.com/thread/4640/brit-progress-poppet-valve-regulator

I did the same with my 'Better Bender' a couple of years earlier. More beer!
John

[Roger]

I'd be careful about doing that. The declaration that you sign when agreeing to them publishing an article states something to the effect that it's their sole right to do that.
I did get one article published a while ago, but the publisher sent neither thanks nor encouragement so it will certainly be my last. Since the editors of these magazines regularly send out requests for articles, it surprised me that there was absolutely no feedback.

[jasonb]

Its only the article as they arrange and present it that they have rights to. If the subject has been on the web elsewhere before or if you want to write about it again then there is no issue.

There are quite a few things in ME and MEW that have been on the net before finding their way into the pages.

[simplyloco]

Jun 16, 2016 19:37:47 GMT jasonb said:

Its only the article as they arrange and present it that they have rights to. If the subject has been on the web elsewhere before or if you want to write about it again then there is no issue.

There are quite a few things in ME and MEW that have been on the net before finding their way into the pages.

Agreed. I made it quite clear that I had published 'something similar' on the MECH Forum and there was no issue. My little two pager is just a 'filler' between spaces!
John

[Jo]

Its a shame that over the last 20 or so years the amount per page Mags pay has gone through the floor..... no wonder today they are padded out articles with pictures to increase the page count.

In the old days writing for an ME mag was a good supplement for the old pension but £50 a page is...well...really is it worth the effort? Especially if having done all the work and sent it in it may not even be published. If they ask to reproduce something you have done from a forum you have a better chance of it being published in a reasonable time frame.

Jo

[pault]

I had contact with the pervious editor of ME some years ago about a potential article. There were so many obstacles put in the way by him that I did not bother.

[jasonb]

I suppose the only problem with paying more per page is that it will just put the price of the mag beyond what a lot of people are willing to pay particularly if they are only interested in one aspect of ME so a lot of articles maybe of not real interest.

I don't have a problem with lots of photos provided they are relevent and one photo can often convey what it would take several paragraphs to explain but there is a fine line between whats best included and what is packing. There is also the option of additional info and photos being hosted on the ME website so filling out an article with things that may not be of interest to most readers can be included for those that may want to build the item of tooling or model featured.

I think the fee can be considered a bonus, you are not going to earn a living out of it but lets take the build of say a stationary engine - 3 pages per issue, 6-7 issues at £50 a page. That is around £2000 before tax, which will easily cover the cost of materials or castings, any tools, fixings, finishings that were used on the model and probably go a long way to paying for the next one too. Add to that if you were going to write it up for a forum there is not a lot more work to tidy it up a bit for the mag. I have found the biggest amount of work is producing the drawings as you can't really send ig a fag packet sketch that would have done the job in your own workshop.

I should say for those that don't know I moderate on ME forum on a volintary basis, have had articles published and will have more in the future, some I have taken payment for others I had the money donated to ME's chosen charity.

[Jo]

It was only the other week that I was shown John Bertinant's original drawings and hand written notes that he sent in with his build series on the Borderer back at the end of the 80s. The drawings were well drawn but the publishers at the time had two tracers who would draw up all the designs that were sent in in a consistent manner for publishing through out the Mag. (No doubt the girl's re-draw contributed to some of the miss dimensions that are still on the plans today.)

And what was nice about that arrangement was that you could and still can buy those plans as full sheets rather than having to copy the bits and pieces out of mags if you wanted to make one yourself.

Jo

[spined]

Jason
If you or anyone has some drawings that they would like to see in publishable form, let us have a look at them at modelengineeringwebsite.com. If they are complete we might be able to produce CAD drawings for you, for publication on MEWS as well as for your own use wherever you like
I don't know why people get so hung up about copyright agreements. If anyone doesn't like what they are being asked to sign, just cross out the offending bits, sign them and send back.
Alternatively, deal with people like MEWS. As we say:
"Everything on MEWS (just like everywhere else) is somebody’s copyright. You cannot reproduce material elsewhere without permission. Mostly we will arrange permission. Just be sure to ask. Similarly be sure you have permission to use material in articles you send to us to publish. Anything you write for MEWS remains your copyright. Simple. No need for a lawyer to work out what you are giving up! The answer’s ‘nothing’."

Jo
The tracers are long gone. ME and (probably) MEW did have a staff illustrator, nice guy called Grahame Chambers who lived on a Greek isle. I think ME stopped using him after I left about seven years ago, tho his name is still on the flannel panel.

[Roger]

Jun 22, 2016 12:23:43 GMT spined said:

I don't know why people get so hung up about copyright agreements. 

We're not legally trained, and it's not clear from the documents what the extent they may cover. That's why there are misunderstandings. If you deal with these things all the time, it might be obvious, but to many of us it's off putting. I wasn't sure if I could use a photograph that I'd previously put on a Forum for example.

[spined]

Roger

If you took the photo, made drawings, or wrote an article, it's your copyright, unless you've signed it over to someone else. Even your emails are your copyright.

If you are not sure about signing something then change it, even cross out every clause, before you send it back.

[Roger]

Jun 22, 2016 14:25:38 GMT spined said:

Roger

If you took the photo, made drawings, or wrote an article, it's your copyright, unless you've signed it over to someone else. Even your emails are your copyright.

If you are not sure about signing something then change it, even cross out every clause, before you send it back.

Where I'm confused is in a scenario such as this. I take a photo and post it on a Forum, so it's my copyright. I then decide to include that photo in an article and sign the standard document about copyright for the document when it's published. Have I handed over the copyright to that photo? I've got it on a Forum, so am I now in breach of the copyright I've just signed? It all seems very complicated to me.

[Jo]

Roger, If you have already put it on the forum prior to signing away your rights to a third party you are ok: the copyright was yours when you originally posted it.

Where you could fall foul is if like me my contract of employment says my employer owns the copyright on anything I do (at work or in my own time). So I cannot sign over the rights to it to a third party. But they are happy with me posting my Modelling on the Forums (they see it as encouraging another generation of engineers) but would get twitchy if there was any payment involved.

Jo

P.S. Part of my day job includes is dealing with contracts/legal people and copyright is one of those things we constantly have to deal with.

[jasonb]

Roger, David (spined) has published several of my engine builds on MEWS all of which he basically copies and pastes from Forums where I have posted the build thread, we are both happy with the arrangement and there are no copyright issues.

As I said earlier the only time someone like ME or MEW may get twitchey is if they have edited/retouched/altered a photo or text in anyway and you were to copy and paste that article from the mag elsewhere as it is that arrangement of the text/photos/layout etc which is their copyright.

I've got an engine build going into ME soon, I have posted some photos of the engine on the net but personally feel that if somebody is paying for a mag they should get original content so have not show much of the build elsewhere. I'm also hoping that rather than pad out teh mag article some additional photos will be available on ME website and also DXF files for laser cutting etc. As well as an interactive 3D image that can be manipulated.


David, I'm able to do my own drawings but thanks for the offer. As an example this build which has been posted on ME forum and MEM forum has links to drawings that can be downloaded.

www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=114711

Jo made an interesting point in her earlier post about being able to buy plans of long ago published projects that were in ME. I don't think I have seen any new subjects being offered by MHS since they published Malcom Stride's Lynx and that may only have been to try and recover what the other DC spent to get them! It's a pity to think that any new engine or loco covered in the mags since then won't have a set of plans that a buding builder could buy 10, 20 yrs down the line. Or is it cheaper now to buy a digital sub and get the last 14rrs and couinting back issues and print off what you need for the cost of a cartridge and some paper.

J

[spined]

Apart from the Lynx I think you'd probably have to go back more than 20 years to find more new additions to the ME plans service. In fact most of them are by 'staff' before then. These days there are no staff designs which is a pity but inevitable - it must have been great working for a fully staffed ME with its own workshop and drawing office. Designs that appear in the mag these days usually remain the copyright of the originator, and these are often available from other sources. Polly Engineering, especially, have many of the Anthony Mount designs, plus Neville Evans, the great Pete Rich and more.
These days few people are going to want to pay up to £100 for a set of drawings when they can quite legitimately (for personal use) make pdfs of magazine pages and send them off for A1 printing at 40p a sheet for use in the workshop (assuming the originals are of good enough quality).

[doubletop]

Most, if not all, of Stewart Harts builds first appeared on one forum or another (HMEM or MEM). I had a post on here that turned itself into the "frame mapping" article. I was happy with the effort and reward, the only problem was it used up some build time to put together.

Pete