smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
Posts: 2,269
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Post by smallbrother on Sept 23, 2019 19:35:10 GMT
The Pumphouse team have found a number of gauges with bezels that are very reluctant to come off. They do give way eventually, but it can be a bit fraught trying to do it without damage. Wilf I tried one of my gauges a few years ago and the bezel was a swine to remove. Not sure how it all stayed undamaged. I am reluctant to risk it again. Pete.
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Post by ettingtonliam on Sept 23, 2019 20:31:47 GMT
You'd think, wouldn't you, that the minature gauge manufacturers, knowing damn well that the purchaser is going to have to put a red line on the dial to get his boiler certificate, would make it easy take the front off and access the dial?
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
Posts: 2,269
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Post by smallbrother on Sept 24, 2019 7:39:27 GMT
You'd think, wouldn't you, that the minature gauge manufacturers, knowing damn well that the purchaser is going to have to put a red line on the dial to get his boiler certificate, would make it easy take the front off and access the dial? Well that would be my approach to it in their shoes! Pete.
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Tony K
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,573
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Post by Tony K on Sept 24, 2019 8:35:25 GMT
You'd think, wouldn't you, that the minature gauge manufacturers, knowing damn well that the purchaser is going to have to put a red line on the dial to get his boiler certificate, would make it easy take the front off and access the dial? Yes - these small gauges are quite delicate (just like me! ) and least they are messed around with the better. They do work remarkably well for what they are. ....I see the only proper solution on this is red paint line on the gauge dial and its fairly simple to do. Adam Agree Adam - but I have seen some really crap efforts at this - including my own! Could be a desire here to go prettier (just like me again!) with less effort. I use automotive pin striping tape as it sticks well on the face of the dial and is easily removed if needed. Also the thickness of the tape is exactly 10 PSI on my gauge. Denis M I am with this. I use dymo red tape on the dial, shaped as a pointer, positioned with forceps - it is a little more rigid than insulation tape and sticks nicely.
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Post by delaplume on Sept 24, 2019 9:33:45 GMT
Good morning Gentlemen----------Did I miss something or did George not spell it out quite clearly earlier on ??...........I also am of an age where nimble dexterity has long passed me by but I still manage to comply with the rules....How ??.....Quite simple really, put your personal pride to one side and ask someone else to do it for you.( Dismantle the gauge )............generally a younger person, alas but compliance is what's required here not personal satisfaction...Works for me!!!!
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Post by chris vine on Sept 24, 2019 9:35:20 GMT
I don't get the point of the red line at all!
To me, these little gauges are only an approximate indication of the pressure in the boiler. The safety valves are the safety device and we need to know that they work.
Putting a red line on a very approximate measuring gauge doesn't add anything to safety at all, as far as I can see..
Chris.
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Post by durhambuilder on Sept 24, 2019 10:20:42 GMT
No problems marking the gauge, use a cocktail stick to apply the paint.
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Post by delaplume on Sept 24, 2019 15:15:16 GMT
Quote}--- "Putting a red line on a very approximate measuring gauge doesn't add anything to safety at all, as far as I can see.."
Better an approximate red line than no red line at all ---surely ??....How are you going to test and operate that boiler if you have absolutely no idea what's going on inside it ??
Those valves are just one part of the Boilers safety requirements......Equally applicable are the rules and codes for its' construction..and also it's use and operation.....which by inference also includes the operator..
Interestingly enough there appears to be quite a few Rules / Regs.. regarding the construction of the Boiler but nowhere can you find some sort of assesment or Code of Operation for the operator.
In any event at the moment these are the rules that you have agreed to abide by, are they not ??......Come your boiler's next scheduled test --- whether steam or Hydraulic ---- will those of you who have openly stated that they use something applied to the glass be presenting that gauge as part of the test ??..........Don't be surprised if the Boiler Examiner asks you to change it for a compliant one...
Finally I believe that the various different Federation Insurance covers ----- like any vehicle or House Insurance cover ---- requires that all Rules /Regs mentioned in the policy be adhered to or cover becomes null and void....
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JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,912
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Post by JonL on Sept 24, 2019 17:55:02 GMT
Delaplume, I've had a read through and no-one has actually said they mark the glass. It was suggested in a throwaway comment, and immediately discounted.
I think we all agree that the glass is a no-no, no-one is disputing that.
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Post by delaplume on Sept 25, 2019 1:55:09 GMT
Delaplume, I've had a read through and no-one has actually said they mark the glass. It was suggested in a throwaway comment, and immediately discounted. I think we all agree that the glass is a no-no, no-one is disputing that. With hindsight I should have put in an Edit to read thus}--------- " OK, rant over" I've run out of the little Red pills again and life becomes a curved ball for a while... Mind you I agree with someone who asked why the manufacturers don't make it easier for us to dismantle the gauges for marking...........Taking that thought a step further why not offer a range of gauges already pre-marked ( typically 80 and 100 psi ) OR offer a "mark-to-order" service ?? Maybe somebody on here could offer that last one ??
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Post by aussteam on Sept 25, 2019 9:33:36 GMT
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Post by steamlaser on Sept 25, 2019 9:38:02 GMT
Gauges do alter over their lifetime due to misuse and mechanical aging. It does make sense to recalibrate gauges as and when required to ensure some sort of consistent accuracy. One reason for the red line MIGHT be that those of use who wear glasses may not be able to see the small letters on a gauge from a distance. However they may be to resolve a red line more clearly? ( I now climb behind the firewall to protect myself)
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Neale
Part of the e-furniture
5" Black 5 just started
Posts: 282
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Post by Neale on Sept 25, 2019 9:49:31 GMT
I'm with you on that - as a glasses wearer, even with varifocals, the gauge is difficult to see sometimes. The numbers are almost always unreadable on the run, and doubly so if it's a bit humid and the glasses are steaming up! A black pointer and its position relative to a clear red line is very useful. Actual pressure isn't that important a lot of the time - more "it's a bit over halfway up so I can manage the bank out of the station OK" is what I'm looking for.
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Post by ettingtonliam on Sept 25, 2019 17:04:33 GMT
I was told that good practice with gauges of all types was that at normal operating levels, the needle is straight up. That way, if you've got a lot of gauges which you have to keep an eye on, you don't have to read the values, just look for ones where the needle isn't straight up. So it helps when choosing a gauge to go for one where the maximum pressure is twice the working pressure, then you know where the needle is supposed to be without having to try reading the scale. That plus the red line the boiler regs require us to mark on the dial.
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timo
E-xcellent poster
Completing 3 1/2 Rainhill .Building 5" Railmotor and waiting to start 3 1/2" King
Posts: 234
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Post by timo on Sept 25, 2019 18:24:38 GMT
I wonder if you use a gauge with max pressure twice the working pressure that you will be using a more linear part of the bourdon tube? It might even keep its accuracy for longer as it will be the thicker part of the tube which is being used and so less prone to stretching?
Any ideas?
Tim
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Post by RGR 60130 on Sept 25, 2019 19:25:15 GMT
Keeping within the mid range of the gauge tends to reduce hysteresis errors. Marking the dial isn't always without its own problems as I have at least one gauge where the dial isn't rigidly secured in the body and can be rotated over a range of >10psi.
Reg
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JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,912
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Post by JonL on Sept 25, 2019 20:19:04 GMT
Trying not to derail the thread, I did use one capable of twice my working pressure when testing my stuart boiler as I wanted the gauge joint to be one of the ones checked. It was very accurate throughout.
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twombo
Seasoned Member
Posts: 119
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Post by twombo on Sept 26, 2019 21:00:42 GMT
Yes Jon, your approach, Aligns with. My experience and training in avionics and instrumentation. I note, also your comment regarding marking of aircraft gauges. I remember well applying the pre cut markings for standard aircraft gauge sizes. 3 3/8” and 21/8”, as i recall. They could be devilish to apply in the cockpit! Best done on the bench,
vice, on a toasty parking ramp! Imagine doing 8 sets of engine instruments on a B52, on a hot summer day, no Less! Yikes! Keeping a boiler inspector Happy, adds a another level of . Bureaucratic Difficulty!
All the best!
Mick
Mick.
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
Posts: 2,269
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Post by smallbrother on Oct 11, 2019 16:16:13 GMT
Well I bit the bullet and took the gauge off and wrestled with the bezel. Off it came. Line marked and then wrestled the bezel back on with a bit of vaseline to help it on its way. Seems to be OK. Perhaps being a large size helped.
Pete.
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Post by delaplume on Oct 11, 2019 18:43:56 GMT
A large one that needed some vaseline eh ??.........Nice one, Peter !!!
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