Unstreamlined Duchess

[waggy]

Hello all,

Does anybody know of a general arrangement drawing for an unstreamlined "Duchess" pacific? I've got copies of the streamlined version but they don't relate to the unstreamlined boiler cleading, which is the bit I'm interested in. The only ones I can find are those in "Historic Locomotive Drawings in 4mm Scale" by F.J.Roache. These are fine for most detail matters, but don't carry enough dimensional info.

Regards and Happy Christmas to you all.

Waggy.

[chris vine]

Hi Waggy,
You could try Jim Vass through JVML, 23 Snowhill, Maulden, Bedfordshire, MK45 2BP,
or you can phone/fax your order to [phone], or e-mail [e-mail]

He has a 7.25" gauge design for a duchess and is a mine of information. he could well have just the drawing you are looking for....

chris.

[waggy]

Chris and John,

Many thanks for the info and the warning. I'll take him as I find him but will be wary!

Regards,

Waggy.

[David Thompson]

Waggy,

You could look at "Modeller's Back Track", Volume 3, Nos 4 and No 5, Oct/Nov 1993 and Dec/Jan 93/94 repectively. There are several scale drawings of unstreamlined and de-streamlined Duchesses, as well as the works GA of the streamlined version. As a matter of fact, I have a good scan of the un-streamlined side view (LMS 6233 Duchess of Sutherland) I could email you. I could post it on the site, but the copyright position would be dodgy. It's also quite a big file. I'll post this message and then see whetehr your email address is already public.

David.

[steammadman]

Waggy, Clarksons of yourk used to have drawings of the type you req.
got an old original catalogue some where will look it up

[steammadman]

Failing that , waggy, try the railway museum archives section the may be able to help you
they have 100's of drawings on file. Not sure but i seem to think they have a full set of
Henry Clarksons drawings.

[steammadman]

Waggy,
Our friends BLACKGATE do drawings for a rebuilt duchess

sorry my Clarkson drawings are too rotten now to use,
like me they have seen better days.

[waggy]

Hello Steammadman,

Thanks for looking out the Clarkson drawings and for the other info you list.
Blackgates are now the outlet for Michael Breezes designs, they are the drawings I'm working to. The firebox wrapper radius is shown at 1" but this is too tight I think, doesn't look right.
David Thompson has mailed me a good front end drawing which puts the radius at nearer 1.5". I'll settle for that as it looks better. Might not be correct but is easier on the eye!

Thanks again,

Waggy.

[cob]

Hello fellow Duchess builders. I first bought M.Breeze's drawings in 1991, but as I was bringing up a family, and renovating an old farmhouse to live in, didn't have a lot of time to get on with it. Now I guess I am about two thirds through rolling chassis and boiler. I have found many discrepancies with the drawings, but found that some of the drawings have been modified. I think this is more of a lookalike than an accurate minature. This has meant that I have had to do a lot of research from photo's, drawings, etc. I did become a Patron of the Duchess Of Sutherland which gave me a chance to take loads of photos for reference. the problem now, is getting modified drawings, and more importantly, castings. I too have have ordered off Blackgates, and even spoke to them at one of last year's model engineering exhibitions, but have heard nothing from them. There must be someone else who does these castings surely?I have resorted to fabricating some of them recently Just to make a bit of progress. I will post some of the problems I have encountered, and some I still have to find an answer for later .Regards. Eddie.

[alanstepney]

I cant help you re castings, and suspect that you may have to make your own patterns and have castings made. Or perhaps adapt a different casting.
(Or fabricate them?)

You mention erros on the drawings.
I would be grateful if you could let me have a list of them so that I can add them to my website, to save future builders of the same model the problems you have experienced.
(www.alanstepney.info)

[waggy]

Alan,

The Duchess is my third 5" loco. I've done Martin Evans' B1 and Tony Alcocks' Jubilee. The B1 was a good first loco to build, taught me a lot. The Jubilee is a true scale loco and took me nine years to complete, certainly a challenge and taught me even more!
The Breeze Duchess is a good looking loco when completed and does look right. There are mistakes, I quickly learnt to check all dimensions against other drawings in the pack, this after I found the crank axle wouldn't fit in the frame. The gap between the leading horns is narrower than the width of the built up crank. I posted a warning on the site a couple of years ago. The boiler is also too wide at the throatplate, however it does look right.
I don't know if Michael Breeze intended a scale loco or one that looks good, I go for the second option.
I've used castings from Reeves for the loco wheels, everything else is from the solid or fabricated.

My advice for prospective builders -
If you've a lot of experience, building the Duchess will certainly test you!
If you're not sure, DON'T!

Waggy.

[duchessmike]

I don't know how relevant this is, but I'm sure you know that Modelworks is doing the Duchess in kits for the non-machinists like me; and I believe that they will sell 'individual' items or bits to anyone that needs....
Mike

[waggy]

Oh dear, it would appear we're in the wrong again!
However, I still wish to thank everybody who replied offering advice, whether it be directly associated with my initial query or not. All useful stuff.
I dare say if our members answered questions directly we'd end up with a lot of "yes and no" type answers containing no information whatsoever! Not what we want, I'm sure.
Keep up the good work peeps, perhaps one day, those who like to impose their strong will might go away and leave us simple, mortal people alone.

Regards,

Waggy.

[waggy]

Dr John, where have you gone?

[mutley]

he woould have appeared to have thrown his toys out the cot again. Shame he actually had some useful input when not telling us his way was the only way.

Andy

[Shawki Shlemon]

I think he will be back , he must be preparing for the next round !