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Post by steamer5 on Nov 27, 2021 10:08:33 GMT
Hi Darren, The loco i mentioned is 7 1/4. A friend, now gone to the big workshop, used several 12 volt think 7 amp alarm system type batteries to give 24 volt, in his electric loco(not a steam one) 6 if memory serves, maybe a possibility to get them in your "boiler". A useful source of reduction gear box is 4 or 5" angle grinder heads, mines 5 times reduction, also allows a 90 degree drive change.
Cheers Kerrin
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oldnorton
Statesman
5" gauge LMS enthusiast
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Post by oldnorton on Nov 27, 2021 10:49:09 GMT
Yes, there are two, big models of about that gauge at West Shed, Butterly (same place as looks after Duchess of Sutherland). They have been restored.
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don9f
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Les Warnett 9F, Martin Evans “Jinty”, a part built “Austin 7” and now a part built Springbok B1.
Posts: 960
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Post by don9f on Nov 27, 2021 16:30:19 GMT
Well one of them has been restored and is a runner, the other one is in bits, only partially restored. They are 21 inch gauge and came to the site from a scrapyard in Lincolnshire....I think they had been at Butlins in Skegness many years ago? They are powered by Dorman diesel engines with hydrostatic drive and I believe they date from the 1930’s, like the real locos. I took this photo this morning:- Cheers Don
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darrene
Part of the e-furniture
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Post by darrene on Nov 27, 2021 22:08:18 GMT
Hi Darren, The loco i mentioned is 7 1/4. A friend, now gone to the big workshop, used several 12 volt think 7 amp alarm system type batteries to give 24 volt, in his electric loco(not a steam one) 6 if memory serves, maybe a possibility to get them in your "boiler". A useful source of reduction gear box is 4 or 5" angle grinder heads, mines 5 times reduction, also allows a 90 degree drive change. Cheers Kerrin Hi Kerrin, I wondered Yes a 7 1/4 would certainly provide a good few options for locating the batteries. I think the boiler shell would certainly be an option for the batteries although as you say, using a few smaller packs possibly in serial and parallel would be the way to go. I am going to make up a few battery-sized blocks and use them to play around with, testing locations.
Thanks too for the heads-up regarding the angle grinder as a gearbox source - a great bit of repurposing It's handy to know the reduction ratio too!
I am going to need to try and get the tender wheels off their axles if I can, in order to fit the gears and possibly an axle-hung bracket.
I'm unsure whether the wheels have been glued or pressed on but given the age, I suspect they're pressed.
So my main dilemma is going to be whether i try a puller, trying to pull and support as much of the wheel backface as I can or opt to be more brutal and slice the axle in half, sleeving and pinning it back together once I'm done..
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 27, 2021 22:15:39 GMT
Thanks for taking and posting that picture Don. That's awesome!
We're only about an hour away from the midlands. I shall need to go and visit, especially the West Shed experience!
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Post by chris vine on Nov 27, 2021 22:35:00 GMT
If you used the angle grinder motor as well, your locomotive would go quite fast!!!
Chris.
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br52
Member
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Post by br52 on Nov 27, 2021 22:35:03 GMT
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 28, 2021 8:04:33 GMT
If you used the angle grinder motor as well, your locomotive would go quite fast!!! Chris.
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Post by steamer5 on Nov 28, 2021 8:59:19 GMT
If you used the angle grinder motor as well, your locomotive would go quite fast!!! Chris. Hi Chris, Yep it would but dragging the power cord/flex around would be a pain! I found cutting the armature off a bit of a mission...glue a short length of hex to the shaft & then the mark3 coupling made from a 3/8 flexible socket set coupling modified to have the right size socket on the spigot end has worked great! My motor is mounted vertically with the grinder head below that with a suitable gear attached. Cheers Kerrin
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darrene
Part of the e-furniture
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Post by darrene on Nov 28, 2021 13:19:23 GMT
True..but with an extension lead you could probably run on 25m long tracks I can imagine cutting the armature shaft must have been something of a chore Kerrin!
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 28, 2021 13:26:43 GMT
While we're on the subject of angle grinders....Some careful work with the slitting disk to remove lower part of the rear coal bulkhead and the sloping floor means challenge number one is complete - the 34ah test battery fits beautifully and although the photo doesn't show it very well, there's plenty of room for the second, to get me 24v and a decent amount of weight over the driven axles
There will be just enough room for a resin or a real (shallow) coal load on top of a false lid over the top.
The existing holes for the original pump unions can serve as glands to route the motor cables beneath, to the controller which I plan to mount in the rear of the tender aft of the coal board. This should mean the only harness needed between tender and engine will be the direction and regulator. I mentioned using a traditional style regulator for the speed control but I see no reason why I couldn't use limit switches on the original reversing handle in the cab too for the direction switching! Darren
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 28, 2021 13:39:15 GMT
I have found out a little about 6200's history after the previous owner's son contacted me. It appears she was purchased back in early 2000 from View Models in Aldershot. I shall need to contact them to see if they have any information going back further..
The front bogie requires completing - It is currently sans spring hanger frames and bolster/rubbing plate. If anybody has any Duchess bogie parts to use as a starting point before I get started next year fabricating some, please let me know. I'm reasoning that Duchess bogies parts will be identical; they certainly look to be.
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 29, 2021 17:36:02 GMT
Pardon my ignorance here...can anyone educate me as to what these are for underneath the last driver? Darren
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mbrown
Elder Statesman
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Post by mbrown on Nov 29, 2021 17:56:21 GMT
They look like spring hangers for leaf springs.
Malcolm
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 29, 2021 19:36:07 GMT
Thank you Malcolm. That makes a deal of sense given their location!
What had confused me I think, was that the builder hadn't progressed the others. I suppose they must be for dummy leaf springs, as the axleboxes themselves seem already sprung.
Darren
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Post by 92220 on Nov 30, 2021 14:38:07 GMT
Hi Darren.
Parvalux used to make dc motors with a right angle reduction worm drive, which would be ideal for your purpose. We used to use them on the Wynstruments straight-line wipers we used to make for ships back in the 1960s/70s. They were available up to 1/2 hp, and any standard dc voltage up to 120v. I don't know if they are still available, but they were superb motors.
Bob.
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uuu
Elder Statesman
your message here...
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Post by uuu on Nov 30, 2021 16:31:06 GMT
If you have a worm drive, might you end up with a model that can't be moved, except under power? This might also reduce your ability to use motor-controlled braking.
You might need to arrange a method of disconnecting the drive allowing a freewheel.
Wilf
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Nov 30, 2021 19:47:31 GMT
Thanks Bob and Wilf. Parvalux do seem to be a well established company with a decent reputation. I did notice that the company supply versions of their motors with right-angled gearboxes as standard - I'm pretty sure they're used for stairlifts as well as many other commercial applications. When I approached their support email with a question regarding a particular model number one eveningI, they replied with the rpm and wattage at around 7am the following day - that's what I call service! I was veering away from the worm-drives (which I believe the Parvalux gearboxes employ) for the reasons you mentioned Wilf. I am intending to use some of their motors but through a spur and pinion instead. Like this arrangement
Darren
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Post by 92220 on Dec 1, 2021 8:41:34 GMT
If you have a worm drive, might you end up with a model that can't be moved, except under power? This might also reduce your ability to use motor-controlled braking. You might need to arrange a method of disconnecting the drive allowing a freewheel. Wilf Good points Wilf. Not having driven an electric loco, I hadn't thought of those. Bob.
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darrene
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Post by darrene on Dec 3, 2021 17:23:57 GMT
It's taken a filthy couple of days but the cab, running boards, smokebox and tender have all been stripped and primered. I keep repeating the mantra "it's got to look worse before it looks better" in the hope that I'll start to believe it!
The motors and brackets are winging their way here, so their general arangement can be tried out soon. I think I may look at lining the inside of the tender with some adhesive rubber sheeting, which would would double as both a high-friction surface for the batteries and a modicum of electrical/vibration insulation for them. Darren
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