Newbie from Southport

[sillyoldduffer]

Hello All,

Anyone from Southport here ? (It's not in the South and it's not a port - go figure!).

I've decided, at the ripe old age of 67, to learn how to be a mechanical engineer.  With this in mind, I've bought the following machines upon which I hope to fulfill my engineering ambitions.

A Myford Super 7 lathe (circa 1962 according to the serial number)

A Centec 2b milling machine (circa 1965... but serial number -vs- date is somewhat vague with all Centec stuff)

A Superior manual surface grinder (don't know the date, but 'Superior' is the brand, rather than a claim of 'better than most'!)

A WW2 era band saw of unknown American origin (lend lease to Blighty during times of appalling excitement!)

Various other bits of tooling, measuring tools and smaller machines of no real consequence or interest to most members here.

I'm currently building the 'mother of all work benches' as all these machines need varying degrees of refurbishment, although it is my intention to do a 'nuts and bolts' refurb to all them... full strip down, deep clean, accuracy measurements, modifications, scraping ways, repaints etc., in an attempt to bring them back to 'as new' spec.  Although I consider myself to be fairly 'handy' and having watched literally hundreds and hundreds of YT videos and subscribing to all the great engineering channels and home hobby workshop supremos,  whilst amassing my machine collection and masses of tooling... I am still slightly daunted but determined to bring my ambition and aspirations, to fruition.  I'm hoping that joining forums like this will help me along the way.

With that said, I want to ask a question about the Clarkson Autolock end mill chuck system.  Is there a specific topic board for this type of tool holder, or a past topic and thread?  If so, can somebody point me in the right direction please?

Looking forward to hearing from you!

Cheers,

The Silly Old Duffer  (actually my real name is Kevin - as in the 'gerbil', and if you can remember that youre at least as old as me!)

[uuu]

Hello!

I don't think there is a specific topic board - I suppose the Tools and Tooling section would be the best place to start a thread - or just pose a question right here while you have our attention.

I had a Centec, and used an Autolock chuck with it. Decent machine. I've switched over to using ER25 collets to hold tools - they are more versatile, as they can hold plain cutters as well as threaded. I've not found pull-out to be a problem. And you can hold drills in them, gaining a bit more space under the spindle, compared with a drill chuck. My 2A was lacking in space.

Wilf

[tony9f]

Hello Kevin,

Welcome aboard. I suspect that you have more than a little knowledge of engineering.

I rebuilt a Superior surface grinder last year which I have had for a few years and it is very handy. If you want to know more about it you cam PM me as they seem to be quite rare and there ain't much info on them.

Regards

Tony

[sillyoldduffer]

Mar 18, 2024 13:07:05 GMT uuu said:

Hello!

I don't think there is a specific topic board - I suppose the Tools and Tooling section would be the best place to start a thread - or just pose a question right here while you have our attention.

I had a Centec, and used an Autolock chuck with it. Decent machine. I've switched over to using ER25 collets to hold tools - they are more versatile, as they can hold plain cutters as well as threaded. I've not found pull-out to be a problem. And you can hold drills in them, gaining a bit more space under the spindle, compared with a drill chuck. My 2A was lacking in space.

Wilf

Helo Wilf,

Many thanks for replying, good to hear from you.

Fortunately, my Centec 2B mill already had (what seems to be the obligatory) riser block, so I have about 4" extra clearance.  It was beautifully made by the previous owner.  I'm really only looking at using the Clarkson Autolock system partly because of my lack of experience and word has it that the Autolock system is virtually fool proof, and partly beause I've recently picked up two job lots of of used, but still functional, threaded milling cutters, from two different auctions.  I've gone from having no milling cutters to more than 80 for well less than a £100.  Most of these cutters are the 1"/25.4mm diameter shank, but about 25 of them are smaller shank sizes.  As you will be aware, as a past owner of a Centec mill, the standard tool holder for the spindle needs to be MT2.  I've seen lots of other, larger Morse sizes in the Autolock system for sale, and lots of INT 30 and 40, but hardly any MT2s, which is a bit frustrating.  I'm not confident or skilled enough right now to attempt to rebore the Centec's spindle to accept another, more readily available taper.  I do have an MT2 to MT3 adapter but I'm a little wary to use it just because I fear it might take up more room and negate the extra room manifest by the riser block, and the possibility of adapters adding to potentially greater error (wobble?).  But as a newbie, maybe I'm worrying unduly.

The thought crossed my mind (perhaps naively) that if I purchased an MT3 Autolock, or perhaps even one with an INT 30/40 taper, I could machine it down to MT2 ?  Seems a bit drastic ?  Any suggestions welcome.

Anyway,  the next 18 months or so will be taken up refurbishing my machines, so I expect I'll be too busy to worry about Centec tool holding for the forseeable future.

Pip pip,

Kevin

[uuu]

They do come up for sale occasionally - here's one: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/315135882758  It's only got two collets - but they also come up.

I wouldn't try to alter the spindle.  Much safer to play with the tooling.  I don't know how hard the surface of the taper is - I'd be looking to buy what you need.

There the "Posilock" chuck, which does the same job: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/285480704662


Wilf

Edit - I think the small size Autolock chucks may not take collets to fit a 1" cutter. Need to check. You may struggle to find any style of collet chuck that cn fit that size cutter onto an MT2 shank.

What you may be able to do is to buy a blank-ended arbour on an MT2 shank and bore it 1" - with a clamping screw. Although I'm struggling to find an arbour with a big enough stub.

[uuu]

Also. Having an MT2 one will fit in both sides of the Myford, Which might be handy.

You can't use an MT2/MT3 adaptor if it's designed for tooling with tangs - or itself has a tang. You absolutely must have the chuck held up by a drawbar.

You can get a screw-in tang to adapt a drawbar tool to fit, for example, the Myford tailstock.

Wilf

[oldnorton]

Hello Kevin

I agree with Wilf. Don't even think about re-machining tapers, yes it will be hardish steel but the issue is getting concentricity with the tool holder and getting a taper at the correct angle. It is a grinding job anyway. I would never attempt it.

The Clarkson Posilock chuck is a good piece of tooling but technology has overtaken it. It is very good for never loosing grip of a cutter when things are working hard on big, heavy machines. A situation you are not going to be in.

Golden rule is to keep the cutting tool teeth as close as possible to the spindle lower bearing.

If you have not got a tool holder, then I agree you are best off with an ER25 (or ER32) on an MT2 shaft. Sets of metric collets are very reasonable but try and go for a better grade and not the cheapest on eBay. Rotagrip Vertex Ultra are high spec at £145, and you can budget down from that.

You did the right thing buying up unused threaded cutters, and the shafts just beyond the threads will grip in ER25 collets. You can get a few imperial (1/2" etc.) ER25 collets for an exact fit to the cutters. The big 1" cutters are a problem because they are way beyond any smaller collet chucks ; ER25 max is 16mm. I have R8 tooling and a Bridgeport mill but the biggest I need to grip is 20mm. Frankly, there will not be many jobs where a 1" cutter is essential, but you have got them so I agree to try and use them.

As Wilf said an MT2 Arbour Spindle could be machined to a precise 1" bore and simple grub screw fixings added. Test Arbour concentricity in the mill first, then grip it in a 4 jaw on the lathe and carefully centre, but I think there might be a problem with the MT2 tang not passing down the Myford spindle?

Norm

[uuu]

Myford spindle will take MT2 (if I remember right - I sold mine a while ago) - so no need for a four jaw - just plug in.

Wilf