Mystery Gauge

[the_viffer]

I was running my ground level set up at the vicarage garden party on Saturday (at least when I could get the vicar and the photographer off the footplate).

One of the people there produced a loco for my inspection and advice. The only apparent damage is a cracked gauge glass and a damaged pressure gauge. I advised one of the first steps would be to replace the damaged items and conduct an unoffical boiler test. However before doing that I thought and think it is worth identifing the gauge and ideally the loco since if it is non standard gauge there is not much point in testing the boiler.

The gentleman has just rung to say the wheel back-to-back is "exactly three inches". His exactly is likely to be different from mine but I think not so far off as to include 3 9/32 inches or 2.5 inches.

The loco is very much in more in the earlier 2.5" gauge style than post LBSC 3.5". It is a British outline outside cylinder inside slip eccentric 4-4-2T. Spirit fired with a pot boiler I think. The side tanks appear to be dummies although there is a clack on the boiler side which looks like it is not just for show. A number of the components including the bogie are made up from castings which lead me to believe that it is based on a published design.

The 2.5" gauge association list no 4-4-2T designs on their website.

As I recall, possibly wrongly, the pressure gauge is marked for Bond's.

I'm sorry but I don't have photographs at this time. If there is enough interest I'll try and get some and ask Alan to put them on www.modelengine.co.uk.

I'd welcome thoughts on the gauge and whether there are any tracks for it and on the identity of the loco.

[Tel]

My hunch is it will turn out to be 3 1/2"

[SteveW]

Viffer,

There is a heap of odd sized track at our club that's been there for ages cus it's an odd gauge of the order 3" or so I'm told. It has a scale appearance and is certainly not aimed at some fat old grown up riding around on it. The chairs look like they're made of lead with (maybe) brass rail and wooden sleepers.

If I remember on Sunday (busy open day) I'll have a measure and get back to you.

[the_viffer]

stevew said:

Viffer,

There is a heap of odd sized track at our club that's been there for ages cus it's an odd gauge of the order 3" or so I'm told. It has a scale appearance and is certainly not aimed at some fat old grown up riding around on it. The chairs look like they're made of lead with (maybe) brass rail and wooden sleepers.

If I remember on Sunday (busy open day) I'll have a measure and get back to you.

I'd appreciate that if you get the chance, SteveW.

My experience of 3.5 inch is small. Somewhere I've an Evans Jubilee that I was going to trade with an esteamed (sic) member of this group (you know who you are!). Long ago when the world was young I thought I could win IMLEC with a Canterbury Lamb. When it was clear that I wouldn't I stopped making it. I still remember Erin coming back from her evening class a bit early as I was urgently and unsuccesfully trying to disperse the fumes from brazing the boiler in our first floor (second the way the US people count) flat. Still got it somewhere: watch out ebay.

My experience of 2.5" is even less: I had for a very short time a Clarkson Stanier 4-6-2 with all four cylinders and paintwork applied by a chap whose guidedog was out. Wish I'd kept that one but I couldn't bear either the paintwork or the thought of stripping and repainting.

Anyway the loco I was shown seemed to me to be noticably smaller in scale than even the Canterbury Lamb and much closer the scale of the Stanier.

However what was odd was that the tyre backs were much nearer the frames than the wheel centres so it might be that Terry is right about more than black pudding. Of course machining the tyres to be flush with the back of the centres will take the flanges off so new tyres would need to be fitted which makes the job more than I think it is worth.

[alanstepney]

I have seen mention of 3" (exactly) gauge in old ME's.
Whilst it never became a standard, I think you will find that a few people worked to that gauge.

I would guess they used 5/8" = 1ft.

[Tel]

Yeah, but this was 3" back to back AJ (wasn't it?) In the normal course of events that would make it something under 3 1/4" gauge

[alanstepney]

Not sure if it was 3" back-to-back or 3 " gauge. I suspect the latter.
From memory, it ws in ME's in the 1920's or so, and I suspect that the "standard" gauges were not as standard then as later.
Certainly I have seen 4" gauge quoted, so perhaps people built to whatever they gauge wished.

[SteveW]

Viffer,

The heap of 'odd gauge' track at our club is three and quarter inches internal. There are straight bits at three feet long and curved bits nearer two feet long.

If you need a photo of a bit just say.

[the_viffer]

stevew said:

Viffer,

The heap of 'odd gauge' track at our club is three and quarter inches internal. There are straight bits at three feet long and curved bits nearer two feet long.

If you need a photo of a bit just say.

Many thanks Steve. It shows that there was a gauge just less than 3.5. I am not certain that a photo of the track will advance us much. I 'll try to get my hands on the loco for some photos and measurements.

As I recall there was in the 100th anniversary of ME booklets some information about gauges over the ages. Don't know where my copy is tho'

[chameleonrob]

thers a bit about gauges in the history section on the 7 1/4 gauge society website

[gwrfan]

Hi Guys,

Reading here about 3 and a quarter Gauge, I just happened to look at the ads in the Model Engineer I'm currently using, dated July 1949. Under 'Models' someone wants: "Perfect 11/16" scale 31/4" gauge Locomotives, Coaches, Wagons and other equipment" Seems this could have been a popular gauge at one time then?

Regards from GWR Country!