smokebox riveting

[silverfox]

I have asked around, and had some replies on other sites, but not quite what i am looking for


Problem

5in LNER B1/B17 smokebox rivets
Questions
What is the head size
what is the centre line from the edge of the smokebox to the rivet
what are the centres between rivets.

I did do a few and they looked WRONG!! luckily i can salvage the error, but need this info before drilling again!

Martin Evans doesn't say so and i cant gauge it from the Yeadons books etc although if i had the answers to 1 and 2 i could just about work out 3

Thanks

Ron

[gwrfan]

Hi Ron,

I bought a part-built B1, with a riveted smokebox, which is as follows:

1. Rivet Head size: 0.169 thou.
2. Centre line from edge of smokebox to rivet: 1/4 inch (both ends)
3. Rivet centres: 7/16 inch.

The rivets used in my smokebox are actually 7BA threaded screws wit no slot in them (so they look like rivets!). They can be purchased from EKP Supplies, in Barnstaple, Devon.

In Martin Evans' 'Words and Music' (ME 3087 of 1 Sept 1960) "....and if the fit is good a row of No 50 holes can be drilled around the edge, the holes in the barrel being tapped 8 BA, and those in the smokebox being drilled No 43 and countersunk."

This appears to me to suggest that he has no visible rivets, the screws being countersunk, which is actually incorrect for this loco.

Hope this might help you, rather than add to your problems

Regards from Cornwall,

Geoff ;D

[chris vine]

Hi,

I will try to get out tomorrow to measure what I did on my B1, which is in 7.25 gauge. For the rivet spacing from the edge I scaled from a photograph. I also counted the no of rivets which will give the spacing.

If you look at lots of pics of B1s, some have a rivetted smokebox and some are smooth, I guess welded. I think, from memory, that it depended where they were built, rivetted ones by the LNER at Darlington and the welded ones at the North British Locomotive works in Glasgow. Awaiting correction to that!!!

Cheers
Chris.

[silverfox]

Chris/Geoff

Thanks for the quick replies. Yes my B17 is a rivetted box, other i have seen are 'welded' or c/s rivets. Trust me to go for the awkward one.
Yes EKP super place have used their c/s slotless on the tender and am using the 'slotless screwed rivets' for the smokebox

So its the shed tomorrow evening!

[gwrfan]

You're welcome Ron, and welcome to the site!

Geoff

[chris vine]

Hi again,

Have just measured the smokebox on my 7.25" B1 and have the following.

Centre line of rivets back from front of smokebox (rolled plate, not the ring which protrudes a bit) is 9/32"

Centre line of rivets forward from the rear of the smokebox ring is between 7/16" and 1/2". The join is under the front boiler band.

There are 90 of the B.....rs, which makes dividing easy at 4 degrees each!

The heads are 3/16" diameter which look about right.

Hope that helps,
Enjoy, Chris.