Brass or Steel plate-work ?

[locoworksnorth]

Hello All,

Could some one help ? A friend has asked for some advice about the right material with which to construct his tender and loco plate-work. My immediate reply was brass.... easy to solder rivets in and easier to waterproof the tender by soldering.
I wondered what the more experienced among you think, what about steel, much less costly. Is steel generally seen as the "low cost rather than quality" option.
Any comments welcome.

[Phil Sutton]

Well,bras certainly doesn't rust out,Our club Simplex originaly had steel tanks,but just recently it had become impossable to stop the water leaking out,so now it has new bras tanks that dont leak water everywhere! ;D

Phil

[greasemonkey]

I use both, steel for the plate work on the loco and brass for the tender or anything that holds water. You could use steel for all of it coat the inside of the tanks with one of the resin products available for sealing fuel tanks on cars and bikes. Apparently it works very well.

Andy

[steamjohn248]

We make all our tanks out of stainless steel but if you want to use steel, coat them with black epoxy tar. We use it in the boatyard and it stands up to salt water and all sort of abuse so it would be fine inside a steel tank. I you wish I can give you the contact number

Steamjohn

[chris vine]

Hi, It seems a shame to put all the work into making a tender body or set of tanks and not pay a bit extra to have them in brass. Or even stainless steel.

Steamjohn, what grade of stainless do you use, is it the standard stuff which commercial kitchens etc are made from, and what is that anyway??!!

Cheers Chris.

[markt]

locoworksnorth, i've often thought the same, why not steel? Apart from the obvious, steel will rust. Although brass looks nicer, it's not seen when painted, steel is much easier to paint, much stronger and a sheet of steel is £50 compared to brass at £200. Surely if it's sealed properly using something like 'slosh' it'll be fine. Interesting thread, sort of thing i'm suprised the_viffer hasn't started a poll on

[Tim Bayliss]

Replying to Chis Vine, what grade of stainless to use.
Your 'standard' grade of stainless sheet is grade 304. It comes in different finishes from a mirror finish to a 'brushed' finish. It is relatively easy to work, bend, cut, weld, etc. This grade is suited to fresh water applications but doesn't like salt very much. Use grade 316 for anything with a salt content.
Incidentally if you need to machine something from stainless that is not going to be in an adverse environment use grade 303, it is a pleasure to machine compared to 316.
Tim

[havoc]

Brass (or copper) for anything that holds water. Steel for the rest. If it was good enough in 1:1 it is good enough for me. Most of it is covered in oil anyway. If you run your engines that is.

[steamjohn248]

Tim Baylis has already answrered the question addressed to me. and all he says is true. We use 316 because we use it in the yard and buy it in in 2 M square sheets and always weld it. Further to Tims comments, if you want to machine or even drill SS, use plenty of cutting goo, a very sharp drill, slow speed and plenty of pressure. It work hardens very quickly if you dont keep a good deep curl of swarf coming up out of the hole.

Steamjohn

[chris vine]

Thanks Tim and Steamjohn for the info about the stainless sheet. I already use 303 for all round work, yes it machines beautifully, better than mild steel. (cutting forces a bit higher though).

When you weld 304 sheet, do you use mig or tig for model work? And what type of filler rod do you use, 304?? I have not done tig since being an apprentice years ago and never tried mig.

In answer to Markt, the prices sound rather steep. If you get along to a big non-ferrous metal dealer I think you will pay £50 odd for a sheet of 2' by 4' brass in something like 1 or 1.6 mm. Sometimes, like b and q, they will let you have one with a bent corner or some damage for much less......

Cheers
Chris.

[steamjohn248]

We never weld much less than 1.5 mm and usually 2mm sheet and use good old fashioned stick welder. Murex Nicrex 1.5 or 2.0 mm. Tack the job together then do short runs say 2 cm with a 2 cm gap then go back and fill in the gaps. No distortion if you are carefull and a quick pass with a flap disc looks a good as tig. We've used mig on big tanks and thinks its ok but not for model size stuff.

Steamjohn

[locoworksnorth]

Hello Everyone,

Thanks for all the replys, some very interesting information. Think I will go with the " brass is it holds water" solution.
locoworksnorth