Just to introduce myself Modelworks 9F restauration project.

[Deleted]

Hello chaps-------------personally I follow full size practice wherever possible, ie 2 injectors on the loco only,--one large and one medium (plus the Model Engineers emergency hand pump). Thus you have 2 low pressure connections and 1 high pressure one.....To compliment this set-up carry a couple of proven injectors in the tool box plus the relevant spanners...

[jma1009]

hi peter,

under no circumstances must there be ANY restriction on the water supply to the injector. taking the supply via the tender hand pump delivery is very bad practice. a separate supply is required with a large fine mesh filter in the tender to ensure clean debris free water to the injector (without the filter restricting the feed).

regardless of whether the injector is lifting or not or a strong lifting injector as opposed to a moderate lifting injector, restricting the water supply will reduce the operating range of the injector quite markedly or could cause it to not work at all.

you need 3/16" dia thinwall copper tube for the water supply and the internal passages through the water valves and fittings and connections should be 5/32" dia.

cheers,
julian

[peterdebeus]

Ok thanks, i will change this

This setup is like winson made it in their kits, i think they didnt want to put to much effort in making the models work properly?

time to change it and make an extra feed line for the injectors

[peterdebeus]

I have another question,

The motionwork is fitted quite loose, so im not 100% sure that al the timings are still like they should.
What is the best way to check if the timings are oke??


Also There should be some ''upgrades'' by making some of the steam ports bigger.
Could anyone tell me more about this.
I have removed the cylinder end caps to oil the cylinders as they where quite dry.
so i can see the chanel between the cylinder and the valve now.
If i understand things right this should be the port that gave the problem.
could anyone tell me about how big the diameter of this port should be?

Thanks again,

Peter

[peterdebeus]

i have mesured the steam ports between the valve and the cylinder, there is one 4mm hole and one 3mm hole drilled in each cylinder end.

[Deleted]

Hi Peter

If you look at this old thread: modeleng.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Modelworks&action=display&thread=1586 you'll see in reply #8 that 'Locoworksnorth' opened out the steam passages from 4 to 7mm. However, I don't know how bad the steaming was before this, so it's difficult to say whether it's worth doing. My inclination would be to try steaming first - there may well be other issues, eg with valve timing or valve leakage, that are more detrimental and easier to fix.

Kind regards

John

[peterdebeus]

Thank you verry much John,

I already found out that in my engine there is a 4mm hole, and next to it a 3mm hole drilled.
so that 7mm?? Might be that they already upgraded my engine??

It also has CNC machined motionwork, so it looks like they already put some effort in to make this engine run better.

[Deleted]

Hi Peter

Yes, the 3mm hole is probably an upgrade - the post I mentioned above talks about going from 12.5 sq mm to 38.5 sq mm, which would be a single 4mm hole opened out to a single 7mm hole. A 3mm hole alongside is a different way of doing it, although this only goes from 12.5 to 19.6 sq mm - but still a big improvement.

My Modelworks Britannia has two equal holes side by side, probably 4mm from memory - certainly not as big as 7mm.

Kind regards

John

[peterdebeus]

John,

Thats nice to compare because i think the Brit cylinder are equal to the 9F.
And i havent found anyone that could actualy tell me how it worked out after upgrading.
are you happy with the power with 2x 4mm holes?? or would you make it even bigger?

I was thinking about taking the cylinders off to make the holes bigger, as some people in my club said the ports are way to small, but they dont have any experience with this actual model.
It dousnt make any sence to me to take them of if i only create more wheelspin, speed is not where a 9F was build for, I only need to pull heavy loads at our club track, and its quite a lot of work to take the cylinders of again.

Do you think it will run ok when i leave it like this? of should it be worth taking them off?

Thank you

[Deleted]

Hi Peter

My Brit steams perfectly well with the 2x 4mm holes.

Perhaps someone with access to the Warnett 9F plans or the Perrier/Spink Brit plans can tell us what size the steam passages in the cylinder block are?

I would definitely try steaming it as it is.

Kind regards

John

[peterdebeus]

Yes that would be great... im curious why the diameter was kept so small...
Do you have lot of power you cant even use because of wheelspin when opening the trottle to much with the 2x4mm holes?
maby they had the tought to keep it easyer to control with less power...

[peterdebeus]

I would like to change all the origional valves for the blower, and the steam valves for the injectors, and also the 4 check valves.

Could anybody tell me where to get the best quality valves and would be helpfull enough to help me witch tread size etc i need to order, i realy have no idea of the english tread size as everthing im used to is in metric.....

Thanks,

Peter

[ejparrott]

Les Warnetts 9F was designed with a 3/16" x 1/2" rectangular passage between cylinder bores and valve chest.

The best quality valves in my opinion are from AKRailways in the USA. They have square drive spindles which won't unscrew when the valve gets stuck, a common problem with the UK valves where the handles are tapped 8ba and rely on a nut. Had one member at the club complaining he could never get his winson 14xx injector to work. When I looked at it, it was because the handle was unscrewing on the spindle, rather than feeding steam to the injector. At least when I pointed it out and fixed it, the endless cleaning of the cones had been worthwhile, as it picked up straight away.... I'm forking out for a full set of valves for my manning wardle from AK, as soon as I work out exactly what I need.

[peterdebeus]

Thank you for all this information.

I just send away everything (3 valves and 4 check valves and the wistle valve) to my local parts dealer.
They say they have exelent quality in stock so we will see

I think i am going to fit the handle with a little drop loctite or even solder, to make sure they wont come lose, There are 3 things that can go wrong now.
The handle itself is fitted with a nut, there is an extension between to make it longer, and that shaft is srew fitted on the valve itself... this means 100% chance to get in trouble

I prefer to have a 100% chance that it wont come off instead.

[peterdebeus]

What do you use to paint your models?

Air brush? or a small car pray gun, and what size nozzle?

[ejparrott]

I use standard suction fed spray guns for all my painting

[Deleted]

I used a Fiac Kite spraygun with a 0.5mm nozzle for the main parts of my Britannia, and an airbrush for the small parts. I used spray cans of Upol acid #8 etch as the primer.

Regards, John

[peterdebeus]

Thanks, im going to try get one, i have seen one with a .8mm nozzle.
Should be fine i think.

I already have done the primer with 2K washprimer.
Also have a can of 2K black Polyurethane paint.

So yes its going to be black instead of Green.
I want to make it like the ''workhorse'' it was in BR railways.

[peterdebeus]

already done some of the painting, took some pictures to show my overseas friends

tender sprayed:
Still have to fit the bearing caps and BR stickers.



tried to make a realistic not to smooth paint by spraying the paint with not to much pressure and verry low temperature, it difficult because realy good paint corrects itself.
it worked out quite well, not as good as i would have liked.



loco in my paint shop on my balcony, its the only outside place i have
On this picture its already primered with a chemical solution used to paint workshop machinery
its black and sticks like gleu to every surface you put it on.



cab primered:



maby some expert can take a look at this picture from my cylinder with caps removed.
Here you can see the extra hole that they made.
If you see enything thats not ok, please let me know

[Deleted]

Hello PETER----------------- looking GOOD, matey !! Looking VERY good indeed ---- I think by now you can see that the Black livery is ideal for these freight engines ? ........and when you first open the regulator and those 10 driving wheels start to pull their first load with ease, you'll have a great ;D ;D BIG GRIN ;D ;Dall over your face !! ---------- keep up the good work.......