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Post by Roger on Mar 16, 2021 22:30:43 GMT
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Gary L
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,208
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Post by Gary L on Mar 16, 2021 23:24:14 GMT
[Snip] 20210316_215605 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr I'm wondering whether to Silver Solder the whole thing or not. The alternative is to use permanent Loctite or to tack weld them on, but that might be messy. Silver-solder if it was me, no contest. But if I might make so bold, that conical section doesn’t look right Roger. It is largely out of sight, so you might not be terribly bothered, but I’m pretty sure the original filler was just cut and bent from a length of pipe (i.e. why would it not be?). That being the case, that should not be conical at all, but an angled slice through a cylinder. Probably not what you want to hear, so I’ll shut up now... Gary
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Post by ejparrott on Mar 16, 2021 23:45:11 GMT
I need to embrace this part on a stick technique. I also need to build up a stock of metals! I hardly keep any material stock, I buy what I need to do the job. Only stock I really have is what's left over from minimum orders.
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dscott
Elder Statesman
Posts: 2,438
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Post by dscott on Mar 17, 2021 3:16:36 GMT
Lovely work on the sandboxes Roger. And as a part of my not being able to settle on anything yesterday sanded off most of the machining marks from the tank supporting RSJ's on my 1500 version. Material for us seems to arrive in various boxes every time we have gone to collect a Lathe over the past 2 years! I countered up Eight from Substantial Wooden to Washing up Bowls. A rack built from MDF slabs with 40 mm strips in between. Supported by mini chests of drawers either side these work well. Machining on a stick. Shows 2 steps starting out as a bar held in the vice and leaving the central rib in the middle. Turning this over for the anti slip raised bits at either side. It is also useful to be able to hold these for filing and sanding later. Shows the same method of holding various rods. This enables you to say do 4 slots in the ends of 2 long bars. I now have a lathe dedicated to these!!! Set your stops and do the sides. A bit tedious but by taking off a mm each time you miss it bending. Only remember to not leave it part machined otherwise you end up with it warped. (SORRY I AM LATE TO DINNER again dear) comes to mind. Again you have something to hold it in the Bench Vice for finishing. Roger sets up in the 4th axis. We mortals just grin and do it the almost hard way. David and Lily.
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Post by Roger on Mar 17, 2021 6:40:23 GMT
[Snip] 20210316_215605 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr I'm wondering whether to Silver Solder the whole thing or not. The alternative is to use permanent Loctite or to tack weld them on, but that might be messy. Silver-solder if it was me, no contest. But if I might make so bold, that conical section doesn’t look right Roger. It is largely out of sight, so you might not be terribly bothered, but I’m pretty sure the original filler was just cut and bent from a length of pipe (i.e. why would it not be?). That being the case, that should not be conical at all, but an angled slice through a cylinder. Probably not what you want to hear, so I’ll shut up now... Gary Hi Gary, The top part would probably be made from round tube, but the bottom is formed from flat sheet. The Works Drawings show it exactly like I have it. The tube joins vertically, so if it was round, it wouldn't intersect at all. Quite why they decided to make it that way is a mystery. They could have used a straight tube and joined it onto the top without involving the side at all. It's very odd. Maybe they just had these made for other types, so simply made an adaptor to fit it there. Even so, why only put half the diameter there? Anyway, I can assure you that it's right, even if it may not look it.
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Gary L
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,208
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Post by Gary L on Mar 17, 2021 11:40:47 GMT
Silver-solder if it was me, no contest. But if I might make so bold, that conical section doesn’t look right Roger. It is largely out of sight, so you might not be terribly bothered, but I’m pretty sure the original filler was just cut and bent from a length of pipe (i.e. why would it not be?). That being the case, that should not be conical at all, but an angled slice through a cylinder. Probably not what you want to hear, so I’ll shut up now... Gary Hi Gary, The top part would probably be made from round tube, but the bottom is formed from flat sheet. The Works Drawings show it exactly like I have it. The tube joins vertically, so if it was round, it wouldn't intersect at all. Quite why they decided to make it that way is a mystery. They could have used a straight tube and joined it onto the top without involving the side at all. It's very odd. Maybe they just had these made for other types, so simply made an adaptor to fit it there. Even so, why only put half the diameter there? Anyway, I can assure you that it's right, even if it may not look it. Yes, you are quite right! I made my sandboxes a long time ago, and followed the Adams drawings exclusively and unsuspectingly, as I had nothing else at the time. I see he also got the box shape wrong, making it tapered symmetrically instead of the forward face having vertical sides with a stepped cut out as yours does. I wish I didn't know that now! The stepped notch is there to clear the fastenings of the brake hanger brackets incidentally, which explains a conflict with one of the nuts on Paddington. But as I said to you, it is difficult verging on impossible to see these features when the loco is assembled, so I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. I will forgive Adams on this occasion though; most of the time it is just as easy to make a part to correct dimensions as wrong ones, but for these front sandboxes his simplification did make the construction significantly easier. Gary
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Post by Roger on Mar 17, 2021 22:03:02 GMT
I'm doing my best to keep the Silver Solder where it's needed with Tippex and reducing the amount of oxidisation with plenty of flux, but it's inevitable that it's going to end up as a black mess because it takes such a lot of heat to warm it right through. 20210317_212314 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr The rings around the top have melted, so I added some extra along the conical joint. 20210317_213359 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr Turning it over seemed to look like it hadn't bridged the gaps, so I heated it up again before it got too cold and added some more. It's so hot that you can't get near it with a rod without welding gloves on. 20210317_214121 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr Anyway, for better or worse, it's done. I'll let it cool overnight and see what I've got tomorrow. I'll be happy if it's stayed in place. I'm sure it's going to be massively strong, even if it isn't pretty. I may be wheeling out the Sand Blaster tomorrow!
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Post by Roger on Mar 19, 2021 16:04:12 GMT
As expected, these ended up as a black mess. 20210318_121341 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr I tried to get the Sand Blaster to work yesterday, but it just wouldn't pick up the media. So today I added a regulator and a 4mm hose that I threaded down through the feed arrangement so it would fluidise the media, and that worked a treat. I now need to modify my 3D print and incorporate some air ways so I can apply the air from the outside. Although it has worked tolerably well, it could still be fickle, and I can't be doing with that in the long term. I need something that always works properly every time. Anyway, these have come out plenty good enough. There are one or two spots I'll finish by hand, but it's done a good job. 20210319_155312 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr 20210319_155328 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr
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Post by lankyyorky on Mar 19, 2021 20:57:53 GMT
Hi Roger, For smaller parts I use a clear liquid silver solder flux from HS Walsh (Auflux) which leaves very little, if any, residue and you can see what's happening, it's intended for horological and jewellery work, not sure how it would perform on larger pieces. Regards Dave www.hswalsh.com/product/auflux-flux-soldering-solution-500ml-tf25
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Post by Roger on Mar 19, 2021 22:29:14 GMT
Hi Roger, For smaller parts I use a clear liquid silver solder flux from HS Walsh (Auflux) which leaves very little, if any, residue and you can see what's happening, it's intended for horological and jewellery work, not sure how it would perform on larger pieces. Regards Dave www.hswalsh.com/product/auflux-flux-soldering-solution-500ml-tf25Hi Dave, Thanks for that, I'll take a look. The stuff I use is fine until you have an extended heating session. Normally I get it done in double quick time, but that's just not possible with big chunks of metal.
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Post by Roger on Mar 19, 2021 22:37:15 GMT
The connecting rods and levers all have these Volcano style of oilers, which I haven't made yet. DSCN5641 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr This is a piece of Mild Steel rod being turned down and the 2.5mm radius form tool creating the conical nose. 20210319_212338 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr They're 4mm diameter and drop into 4mm reamed holes. Once fitted, they would be a nightmare to get out, so I'm tapping the hole M1.4 so I can use a bolt to get hold of them. They will probably be just a close fit, I don't think they will come out. The oil is thick, and the holes are deep. 20210319_222319 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr The back of them is drilled out to 3.5mm so there's a pretty large cavity that can be filled with oil. I'll either make an adaptor for the main oil can, or fill them with a syringe. Anyway, here's the first of many in position. It looks like the full size ones are machined as part of the rod since there's doesn't appear to be a join. It's not a perfect solution, but it's good enough. 20210319_222354 by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr
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baldric
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 208
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Post by baldric on Mar 20, 2021 7:37:12 GMT
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barlowworks
Statesman
Now finished my other projects, Britannia here I come
Posts: 874
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Post by barlowworks on Mar 20, 2021 8:18:23 GMT
You might have to consider a hole down the middle of your extraction bolt. If the oilers are full of oil you might have problems removing them because of the suction. Just a thought.
Mike
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Post by Roger on Mar 20, 2021 8:40:06 GMT
Thanks for that Baldric, I guess they've done a better job than I have. At some angles on mine it shows up much more than others, so I think blending it in with emery paper will help make the join disappear.
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Post by Roger on Mar 20, 2021 8:41:40 GMT
You might have to consider a hole down the middle of your extraction bolt. If the oilers are full of oil you might have problems removing them because of the suction. Just a thought. Mike Hi Mike, That's a thought, although it's really only while making them that I was really concerned about. Of course, I could use a similar idea as yours to pump in oil and jack them out. Either solution ought to work.
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JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,912
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Post by JonL on Mar 20, 2021 9:32:53 GMT
A friend from our club has a simplex called Joan (his name is gandydancer on YouTube and we'll worth a look) in which he made individual corks for the oilers as per full size. I've no idea how anyone manages to machine cork.
I suspect I would find plugs of any kind a bit fiddly and annoying, but I suppose it's easier on the rods when the valve gear is inside
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baldric
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 208
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Post by baldric on Mar 20, 2021 9:33:12 GMT
Thanks for that Baldric, I guess they've done a better job than I have. At some angles on mine it shows up much more than others, so I think blending it in with emery paper will help make the join disappear. I am sure yours will disappear with blending in, but what I meant on full size is almost the whole top it recessed, in the picture you can see the straight line just in from some edges. I am not sure how it was held in, the edge riveted over I would guess. Baldric.
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Post by Roger on Mar 20, 2021 10:16:11 GMT
Seeing how adding a bit of air into the blasting media transformes the performance of the shot blaster, I decided to add some galleries to the 3D printed version. I've left the adjustable vent on top, but it's almost certainly not needed. I've 3D printed a 1/4" BSP thread, well almost. It's actually a 60 degree metric thread form, but it's near enough for a print. The channels are 2.5mm diameter with 1mm holes. There's a gallery around the bottom of the main tube on the left, with three holes leading into that. They won't get as much air because they're further away from the supply. Syphon assembly with fluidisation air by Georgia Montgomery, on Flickr I'll have to add another hole in the cabinet with a grommet to bring the air out to the connection. I think it's tidier to have the pipe Tee inside the cabinet and keep the robust air fitting to the comressor where it is.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2021 12:01:35 GMT
A friend from our club has a simplex called Joan (his name is gandydancer on YouTube and we'll worth a look) in which he made individual corks for the oilers as per full size. I've no idea how anyone manages to machine cork. I suspect I would find plugs of any kind a bit fiddly and annoying, but I suppose it's easier on the rods when the valve gear is inside They are probably wood, I used toothpicks cut down for mine, I think it may have been Jim who I got that idea from. They look the part and easy to remove/fit. Pete
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Post by delaplume on Mar 20, 2021 12:16:28 GMT
Hello everyone,
Roger,
I agree with baldric's input and would go a stage further----the oilers you made are spot-on !!..As you can see from those full-size photos they are almost the full width of the bearing boss...They are actually inserts, just like you propose....... When you take the cork out and look inside there is a restrictor fitted just below the surface which controls the oil flow and also stops the cork being pushed down too far....It looks just like a cross-section of a 3-fluted thread tap,if you get my meaning.....
So that's the oil input dealt with....the oil is supplied to the crankpin bearing surface via an elongated, oval-shaped felt pad....... As you may have gathered during the building of your 1501 there are no seals on either side of the bearing so it is in fact a "Total Loss" system, but one that is designed to take a long time to empty.....Remember that each loco would go through an "Oiling-up" procedure before the start of a work diagramme..
PS}--- the only image I can find featuring the felt pad in position has an electronic "block" on it so I can't show it !!!......Anybody out there have one ???
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