JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 30, 2020 18:50:52 GMT
For those of us who can still barely make functioning clacks I think making my own injector is probably out of the question. As a result I plan to buy one. I think this injector is about right for my William, (1.6 litre boiler volume, 90 psi working pressure) as its one of the smaller sizes and a respected design (from my limited research): www.paviersteam.com/fittings-accessories/chiverton-injectors/16-oz-horizontal/Does anyone have any better suggestions? I plan to feed it from a tank on my riding truck, which I will make well filtered, free flowing and air bubble free if I can! For mounting I was planning below the cab. I will consider making my own injectors for the Britannia but I'm still rubbish at basic fittings so an injector just isn't going to happen for this locomotive at least. |
|
|
|
Post by coniston on Aug 30, 2020 19:41:17 GMT
HI Nobby, that one sounds too big for a small 3 1/2" loco, No2 (11oz/min) is as big as I would go, maybe smaller if you can get one. You don't want to flood the boiler every time you start the injector, much better if it can be sized to maintain the water level when the loco is working at maximum steaming capacity.
Chris D
|
|
don9f
Statesman
Les Warnett 9F, Martin Evans “Jinty”, a part built “Austin 7” and now a part built Springbok B1.
Posts: 960 
|
Post by don9f on Aug 30, 2020 21:10:45 GMT
Hi, I agree about the suggestion of a somewhat smaller injector for your “William” and use two of these No2 size (11oz per min) on my own 5” 3F tank engine. This also has a volume of 1.6 litres and is designed for 90psi. They both work well from 90 down to about 40-50psi. One thing they don’t like though is warm water....but that won’t be a problem with your proposal for water supply! Hope that helps Cheers Don |
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 31, 2020 9:06:06 GMT
Very helpful gentlemen, my sincerest thanks.
|
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 31, 2020 9:35:17 GMT
My next issue (of many) is how to feed the boiler. i currently have two clacks, one for the hand pump and one for the axle pump. I'm torn between perseverance with the axle pump and using a tee piece to maybe join that with the hand pump clack, leaving an unshared clack for the injector, or just disconnecting the axle pump altogether, however it seems a backward step to keep with only two methods of topping up. I don't want to even attempt compromising the shell to find another place for a clack, although a way around that may be the separate steam dome fitted to the William which may give me a convenient, if non-ideal place to feed water without touching the boiler shell.
The one thing I do like (and dislike!) About this hobby is the constant challenges!
|
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 31, 2020 9:45:22 GMT
More than anything I'm keen to fix this damned axle pump. It should be the simple solution but I've put hours into this now! I might junk the previous owners efforts and start from scratch. The one I made for my Britannia seems to work well.
|
|
smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
Posts: 2,269
|
Post by smallbrother on Aug 31, 2020 10:36:57 GMT
I believe the injectors supplied by Paviersteam are made by Len Steel and I can confirm they are excellent.
Combining the hand/axle pumps into one clack and the injector (fed separately from the riding truck) into the other seems the best way to go IMO.
Pete.
|
|
timb
Statesman
Posts: 512
|
Post by timb on Aug 31, 2020 11:39:36 GMT
More than anything I'm keen to fix this damned axle pump. It should be the simple solution but I've put hours into this now! I might junk the previous owners efforts and start from scratch. The one I made for my Britannia seems to work well. Hi Nobby,
Just a thought, if you make your own pump you will gain knowledge and have the piece of mind that you have a working solution. The problem you have is that the pump body for William forms part of the stretcher for the loco so is a reasonably sized job to machine and change, however you should be able to machine it and get it working outside the loco, the changeover should then be a days job at the most. Is there anything salvageable from what you have, eccentric strap, ram etc etc?
The castings are readily available - £40 from Reeves (https://www.ajreeves.com/10194.html) - usual disclaimer.
Incidentally there is (or should be) a 10BA stop screw installed to limit the rise of the delivery ball. It might be worth checking that it is there and in good order.
Just my thoughts.
Tim
|
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 31, 2020 11:43:02 GMT
I will check the deliver valve again. Last time I looked the stop was there but for all I know it could be filled with crud again now.
|
|
|
|
Post by coniston on Aug 31, 2020 11:51:13 GMT
My next issue (of many) is how to feed the boiler. i currently have two clacks, one for the hand pump and one for the axle pump. I'm torn between perseverance with the axle pump and using a tee piece to maybe join that with the hand pump clack, leaving an unshared clack for the injector, or just disconnecting the axle pump altogether, however it seems a backward step to keep with only two methods of topping up. I don't want to even attempt compromising the shell to find another place for a clack, although a way around that may be the separate steam dome fitted to the William which may give me a convenient, if non-ideal place to feed water without touching the boiler shell. The one thing I do like (and dislike!) About this hobby is the constant challenges! Hi Nobby, I would also combine the hand pump and axel pump into one clack valve, just remember you will need to close the bypass to use the hand pump, unless you have a check valve between the bypass tee and the hand pump tee on the delivery from the axel pump, if that makes sense. For preference I would not add more check valves but just put up with closing the bypass valve when using the hand pump. Chris D |
|
|
|
Post by flyingfox on Aug 31, 2020 15:27:42 GMT
Greetings, for many years, I have used the hand pump in series with the axle pump, feeding in to one clack. If you suffer from "stuck balls", a few stokes of the hand pump will clear them.
In use the axle pump sucks water through the hand pump, lifting the valves, and keeping them clean.
regards
Brian
|
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 31, 2020 17:33:33 GMT
Greetings, for many years, I have used the hand pump in series with the axle pump, feeding in to one clack. If you suffer from "stuck balls", a few stokes of the hand pump will clear them. In use the axle pump sucks water through the hand pump, lifting the valves, and keeping them clean. regards Brian What a superb idea. Obviously only if you have a third means of putting water in of course, but it makes perfect sense now you mention it. |
|
|
|
Post by coniston on Aug 31, 2020 18:38:20 GMT
Greetings, for many years, I have used the hand pump in series with the axle pump, feeding in to one clack. If you suffer from "stuck balls", a few stokes of the hand pump will clear them. In use the axle pump sucks water through the hand pump, lifting the valves, and keeping them clean. regards Brian Must admit I hadn't considered having them in series, only in parallel, if it has been working well for you then that sounds a neat idea. Chris D |
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Aug 31, 2020 19:18:28 GMT
I quite like that it would assist with priming the axle pump, something which I think I had been struggling with (before now at least!)
|
|
|
|
Post by builder01 on Sept 1, 2020 0:23:21 GMT
Greetings, for many years, I have used the hand pump in series with the axle pump, feeding in to one clack. If you suffer from "stuck balls", a few stokes of the hand pump will clear them. In use the axle pump sucks water through the hand pump, lifting the valves, and keeping them clean. regards Brian This is exactly how I have my hand pump and axle pump piped. It works quite well. I use the hand pump to prime the axle pump. They are in series and both feed into the same boiler clack. This scheme was suggested to me by a friend with much more experience than I. |
|
|
|
Post by Roger on Sept 1, 2020 7:54:04 GMT
Can I point you to my idea of simply modifying the inlet valves on hand and axle pumps so that a little piece of 'O' ring (or a very light spring) lifts the ball very slightly off the seat? That way, they can never get stuck!
It's such a simple solution, I'm staggered that it wasn't thought of years ago and implemented universally since this is a recurrent theme.
|
|
JonL
Elder Statesman
WWSME (Wiltshire)
Posts: 2,909
|
Post by JonL on Sept 1, 2020 8:08:41 GMT
I think my problem has either been keeping the seat clean or making it good enough in the first place. Hopefully now the boiler is cleaner I've a better chance. I suspect I'll use the o-ring idea in the Brit if I can work down that small
|
|
|
|
Post by Roger on Sept 1, 2020 8:32:11 GMT
I think my problem has either been keeping the seat clean or making it good enough in the first place. Hopefully now the boiler is cleaner I've a better chance. I suspect I'll use the o-ring idea in the Brit if I can work down that small The problem with suction valves is that dissolved solids glue the ball to the seat, whatever that's made from, when the water evaporates. The easiest way to avoid this in my opinion is to stop the ball resting on the seat, then it can't happen. |
|
mbrown
Elder Statesman
Posts: 1,720
|
Post by mbrown on Sept 1, 2020 11:42:49 GMT
After endless frustration with stuck inlet balls in the handpump, and dosing the tanks with boiling water etc before a run, I made sure on the Burma Mines loco that the tank drain plug was immediately below the inlet valve so that I can use a cocktail stick to free it - hopefully, remembering to do so before I fill the tank.... The handpump also feeds through the axle pump, so it is possible I won't need the facility to free the ball if the axle pump sucks hard enough to lift it - but at least I can check before every run that the hand pump will work.
I agree that Roger's solution is much more elegant.
Malcolm
|
|
|
|
Post by builder01 on Sept 1, 2020 11:57:28 GMT
I put my hand pump axle pump in series solely for the purpose of being able to prime the axle pump. For me, stuck check balls has not ever been an issue, but, a simple way to free them would be a bonus.
|
|
