steam4ian
Elder Statesman
One good turn deserves another
Posts: 2,069
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Post by steam4ian on Feb 18, 2008 20:12:50 GMT
G'day all I'm in a hurry this morning and promised myself I would not get locked into a discussion, But. tb has been corresponding over the last few days and today's post touched me, I quote "my dad has taken my workbench down". My advice to tb is to make a folding bench or a bench in his bed room, please keep going kid. All I can say is that dad must be an accountant or a lawyer not to realise the significance of a 17 year old having an interest in doing things with his hands that don't involve genitalia, his or others! Brothers we must help this kid, we must help others like him. In Oz I can't do much for tb but there must be others like him. Can anybody get beside him or get him into a group? Please! Regards, Ian
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 18, 2008 20:24:01 GMT
I have kind of converted my computer desk into a bit of a bench where i am building my boat on but my room is a bit cluttered with other bits and bobs. I might end up having to sell some of it to make a bit of space but i might be able to convert my old bedroom(it is a box room about 8ftx4ft) into a shelf room although my mum wants it to be converted into an en-suite.
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denis M
Part of the e-furniture
Posts: 300
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Post by denis M on Feb 18, 2008 20:34:12 GMT
Can not help this lad I'm afraid as we are too far away however my society, City of Oxford S.M.E are trying all we can to encourage the young as the opening page of our website www.cosme.org.uk shows. These youngsters are the future, give them the chance to have a go. Denis
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wayne
Seasoned Member
Posts: 137
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Post by wayne on Feb 18, 2008 20:42:52 GMT
I suppose I didn’t realise how lucky i was when I was 15, my dad built me a half size garage at the side of his garage to keep the bike i was restoring in and act as my workshop. He also donated tools equipment to me to get me started. How times change, that was 27 years ago
However, young people seldom show interest in practical engineering any more, its very important when anybody shows interest are nurtured and encouraged or like any other hobby or trade it will die out
unfortunately the lad lives quit away from me.
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Post by standardsteam on Feb 19, 2008 10:01:42 GMT
I had a similar problem when I moved house, I had no garage. I currently use a workmate for a bench (no ideal I know) and use my father's workshop when I get the chance. I sometimes do some ME work at my local club. He has just got to find a way. It might mean scaling back and making a smaller project, but I think most ME clubs should be sympathetic and hopefully he can use their facilities. Failing that it may just have to be something to come back to when the opportunities arise, I didn't do much ME between 15 and 26, getting back into it later.
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 27, 2008 8:43:19 GMT
My dad took my bench down, so have a guess what i have been doing this weekend. ;D I have got half the garage back and a fully operational workbench. Originally, i cleared the shed out ready for the bench but my dad said to go in the garage. ;D
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Post by circlip on Feb 27, 2008 11:28:34 GMT
tb, being an old cynic (who ME), I would suggest you go back to your first thoughts and SUGGEST to your dad that perhaps fitting your shed out to play with your toys won't inconvenience him should he decide to use the garage to store the car or other suchlike uses, you've already cleaned it out for him? Unless it's a BIG shed you won't be able to park a car in there will you?
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Post by freddo on Feb 27, 2008 11:33:24 GMT
How old did you say you were, tbsteam?
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Richmond
Seasoned Member
My engineering is like this avatar : Projects start off ok, then go off track :D
Posts: 128
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Post by Richmond on Feb 27, 2008 12:12:24 GMT
Earlier this month the next door neighbours son ( a 10 yr old ) wanted to see the workshop........so, I said OK. In he came, with lots of ooh's and ahh's, picking up tools and bits of work willy nilly as kids do. Nothing strange in that, and perfectly normal.
After a while I used the "Please just look, and dont touch"....to which the response was "But, my dad lets me use his drill....My dad lets me use his electric saw...My Dad, My dad etc etc etc"
After politely explaining that tools can be dangerous, but I would show him how do do some stuff with them over time, he duly returned back home.
5 Mins later his dad came round saying he didnt feel comfortable with the son using power tools even under supervision......"But...", I said, "He uses your electric drill and saw", to which the answer was "No he bloody well doesnt!"
Luckily we get on very well, and the upshot is that he is going to buy the lad a "screw together boiler engine combo" which I will help him with. So at least he will be able to get some use of hand tools.
The lad has a genuine interest, but in this mamby pamby nanny state of ours, where metalwork has been replaced by "Design and Technology" parents now have a fear of letting kids, even under adult, and dare I say it, expert tuition, use basic tools.
I wasnt planning on letting him loose on the big lathe, or the mill yet, but in time and with some "workshop experience" under his belt, I would have stood with him and shown him.
Has this put me off, NO!
It just makes me more determined to get kids into our hobby. ;D
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 27, 2008 13:39:16 GMT
How old did you say you were, tbsteam? I am 17.
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tbsteam
E-xcellent poster
Posts: 231
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Post by tbsteam on Feb 27, 2008 13:40:56 GMT
tb, being an old cynic (who ME), I would suggest you go back to your first thoughts and SUGGEST to your dad that perhaps fitting your shed out to play with your toys won't inconvenience him should he decide to use the garage to store the car or other suchlike uses, you've already cleaned it out for him? Unless it's a BIG shed you won't be able to park a car in there will you? I cleared it all out and then put all the stuff that was in it originally back in so i can't really get back in there.
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Post by freddo on Feb 27, 2008 14:23:53 GMT
OK tb - by that age I'd had to leave home and fend for myself ... but that was yesteryear.
Back to the topic of the thread - I remember a trained engineer friend of mine who decried giving children plastic toys and insisted on teaching his 6 year old son how to use REAL tools.
After an afternoon's instruction on using a hacksaw with a piece of scrap metal in the vice, Chris, the father was interrupted by the arrival of his inlaws with their brand new car. After all the oohs and ahs, the car was duly put in the large garage which also served as the workshop.
An hour later, there was no sign of the 6 year old son, so Chris went to investigate ... the son was well through the front wing of the new car with a perfect straight cut with the newly taught hacksaw ;D
Freddo
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ianmac
Part of the e-furniture
Posts: 308
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Post by ianmac on Mar 4, 2008 3:39:02 GMT
NOW THATS A STORY ;D
I am 28 and getting involved in the hobby again but the thing we all need to remember is from the age of 16 onwards kids disapear from the scene.........Girls, Cars and Booze are the order of the day
Once everything has settled back to normal they come back as did I. remember that tooling and such costs an arm and a leg so for most youngens its simply not an option.
My mother and father did nothing to foster my hobby in model engineering. I had asked if i could buy a lathe and showed them the price of the unit.......i was told laughingly sure when you save up. 6 months later i had the 3 grand and was told "NO"
Never quite forgave them ;D but I have all the gear now and my own house and i will not make that mistake with my son.
As a parent there are much worse things a teenager could be doing than learning new skills such as patients, math, logic, problem solving and how to deal with 1st and 2nd degree burns ;D
I'll jump off the soap box now
Ian
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Post by stoney43 on Mar 8, 2008 12:48:35 GMT
hi just to let you all know about the modern day encouragemet of the young. Boy 15 works for the last year at weekends at a steam society station as a volunteer porter from 07-30. to 16.30. So hes asked at school about going on a work placement and asks if he could work in the workshops were they repair the things of railways. School havnt come across this before so say if you can get the info for us then yes that will be ok. Dad goes down to workshops has a talk with gaffer and comes to an agreement that it is ok with them. Info passed to school and an inspection by the school by the placement officer or whatever. Reading between the lines placement officer was horrified by what he saw. Large machines, spanners you cant pick up dirt all round, open fires, steps to climb up, holes in the ground to fall down and persons with dirty hands. Result.- pair of safety boots, fireproof overalls, safety gloves and safety hat for sale on e-bay.
his alternative.- spend a week in a library !
Where are we going as a nation.This area that has grown up with and driven the industrial revolution. sorry for ranting on but!
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Post by stoney43 on Mar 8, 2008 12:50:37 GMT
P.S. This lad doesnt live more than 2 miles from tb.
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steam4ian
Elder Statesman
One good turn deserves another
Posts: 2,069
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Post by steam4ian on Mar 8, 2008 13:05:58 GMT
G'day Stoney I'm speechless. I guess a railway workshop does present some hazards outside the school's normal environment. Surely some kind of waiver or indemnity could have been issued. Years ago when we still had freight trains with brake vans (guards vans, cabooses) you could ride these, even to places where there was no passenger service. The condition was that you signed a waiver indemnifying the Railways Commissioner from any injury sustained whilst alighting from a train at other than a recognised stopping place or passenger platform. I doubt it would be allowed in law nowadays. Maybe the lad could become a lawyer, then sue the school for lost opportunity. Regards, Ian
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Post by circlip on Mar 8, 2008 16:54:21 GMT
Sorry stoney but the lads dad should be made to go to the placement officer and give his throat a massage, and beyond that take it to the local councilor with a call in to the local newspaper. ALL the bullsh4t we are stuck with now is because we have become complacent and ALLOW the so called authorities to crap all over us. Trouble is, we just SIT and moan about it. I wonder how long it will be before we start moaning about immigrant engineers taking over on the voluntary railway operations like the North Yorks and K&WV railway?
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hat
Active Member
Posts: 48
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Post by hat on Mar 8, 2008 17:02:10 GMT
My grandson is train mad - just seven, but his knowledge is outstanding - He went with the school to a County Wildlife Park ( to pet a tiger or two) on the site is a miniature steam railway but the boys were not allowed a ride because the school had not included this in its Risk Assessment. What a nonsense world we have become!
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Post by mutley on Mar 8, 2008 17:46:54 GMT
yet I know of a lad from my model engineering club who spent two weeks work experince at a preserved railway, loved every minute of it and now spends more time there than he does model engineerin. It can be done, I Sugest the lads dad has a chat. When I did mine one of the options was to help build the M25.
Andy
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Post by havoc on Mar 8, 2008 18:54:22 GMT
What we need is some up-to-date plans of engines that can be made with minimal tools using easy to find materials. It should be possible to make well functioning engines without a cnc lathe and mill. Most of the plans/designs now are incredible complex true-to-scale engines with every detail on it. And a lot of model societies just expect nothing less than that presented in their club or the prestige will suffer. I feel we need some designs where you can go to any DIY around and come out with everything you need to build a working engine: tools, materials etc.
Honestly, we shouldn't be refering to lbsc designs because there is nothing better yet. (disclaimer: I have nothing against lbsc designs, my next project will be one of his) We need comtemporary designs of equal standing. I agree it becomes more difficult for youngsters to relate to steam engines but there are possibilities. This may mean other "stuff" has to be involved to make it interesting for them but again, it can be done.
Okay, I admit I might be talking through my you-know-what because I don't know every design out there but I guess most of you will understand.
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