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Post by GWR 101 on Jul 29, 2015 21:41:02 GMT
Getting close to putting the insulation on my boiler (Ceramic lagging) and can vaguely recall some one suggesting a layer of Aluminium foil between one of the layers, not sure if this was for heat retention purposes or as a barrier.
Has anyone done this and between which layer :- Boiler - Cladding or Cladding - Cleading, I assume it should be shiny side innermost. Any help much appreciated, or have I just dreamt it ?. Regards Paul
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Post by Shawki Shlemon on Jul 30, 2015 9:42:37 GMT
Paul , you are not dreaming , there is a thread , I can't remember what was called , yes the foil was mentioned , it basically reflect the heat and the air space acts as insulator , I have used it one of my engines NSW C 36 5" G and worked satisfactory , boiler steaming was excellent and the cladding temperature seems the same as regular insulation , is it better or worst than the normal insulating materials , that is debatable . One thing is different in my opinion is that one needs a little bit more space than required by standard insulators .
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Post by GWR 101 on Jul 30, 2015 10:38:45 GMT
Shawki, many thanks its good to know I hadn't completely lost the plot. My guess was to put it next to the boiler reflective side in, then a layer of 1mm. thick Ceramic matting, then the outer cover of brass or steel. That should keep it nice and cosy, fortunately the smoke box diameter is nearly 3mm. bigger than the boiler diameter so it should be ok size wise. Regards Paul
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Post by steamcoal on Jul 30, 2015 22:20:39 GMT
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Post by GWR 101 on Jul 31, 2015 8:28:28 GMT
Steamcoal.
Many thanks, just what I was looking for I had tried using the search facility but without success, probably "old guy syndrome". That covers (sorry for the pun) the situation exactly, so a raid on the kitchen supplies looks in order.
Regards Paul
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Post by steamcoal on Jul 31, 2015 20:37:12 GMT
Paul.
That good.
My Maisie is still unclothed. Too busy at work then winter came so a few weeks have become several months.
Summers comming now, so is Christmas!
Hayden
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Post by GWR 101 on Jul 31, 2015 21:15:24 GMT
Hayden
Yes I am pressing on to try and get Juliet painted before the real cold weather arrives so completing the cladding is a must. However whilst ordering the paint which has now arrived the helpful chap at Precision Paints said cold weather was not a problem, but as I pointed out it may not be for the paint but it certainly is for me. So hopefully I can be working on the boiler covering whilst the primer / paint on the frames, smoke box etc. gets done and hardens. In steam by November, well that's the plan. Regards Paul
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Post by steamcoal on Aug 1, 2015 15:45:37 GMT
Paul.
When you were talking to the man at Precision Paints, did he say anything about thinning the paints for spray use in colder temperatures?
I purchased some GNR green for my Maisie from them but forgot to get some thinners and was wondering what substitute thinner I could use in its place. Any thoughts as not sure if I need to use their specific Precision brand or other? Considering it is only 5-10% thinning only.
Need to get my thoughts together as hopefully our November will see temperatures in the mid 20's which is ideal for painting my Maisie.
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Post by GWR 101 on Aug 2, 2015 8:37:43 GMT
Hayden.
I am not sure I can be of much help on this because as I explained I am completely new to this type of painting and so my answer is solely based on what I interpreted from the conversation and the reading of various books. I am sure there are contributors who have a wealth of experience who may be in a better position to offer advice.
But to answer you specific questions he didn't mention any thinner to paint ratio changes for different temperatures however I didn't ask the direct question. I believe the temperature question was more related to the cooler air was less likely to be turbulent and so help avoid surface contamination.
Regarding the type of thinners, I can't offer any help on this as I am starting from scratch I have purchased the thinners with the paint, but I am sure as previously stated there are some knowledgeable contributors who can assist.
One thing of note is that I have been recommended to use about 25-30% thinners to paint ratio which appears a lot higher than you have mentioned. It was also mentioned that this may need some adjustment based on the equipment, and trial runs are a very good idea. I believe also the old saying that "practice makes perfect" is true here and I will certainly be doing a lot of this in areas out of sight!
Apologies for not being able to give positive answers but I didn't want to mislead you. Regards Paul
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Post by GWR 101 on Aug 19, 2015 17:19:03 GMT
Hi was just wondering what might be the best method for securing the cleading. Its not something that's covered on the drawings, LBSC mentions lap jointing holding in place with binding wire or string and then securing the edges with a few touches of solder. The bands are secured by strengthening the ends bending at right angles then pulling together with small bolts. Any suggestions or thoughts gratefully received, regards Paul
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Post by runner42 on Aug 19, 2015 23:22:13 GMT
Hi Paul,
I secured my boiler bands using brass angle, soldered and riveted to the band. The brass angle is 1/16" thick to provide a robust connection for the 5 BA brass screw and nut to tighten down on. I did this because I wanted to use the banding to pull the 0.6mm thick brass cladding hard up to the boiler at the bottom where the ends tends to stick up. If you have rollers then your cladding would be better formed and a less robust termination may be required. I am still pondering the best way to secure the banding over the Belpaire firebox area, maybe you have a suggestion? I am going to use 1/8" balsa wood over the Belpaire firebox area to provide a smooth surface where the firebox staying protrudes by an 1/8" and prevent the staying marking the cladding
Brian |
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Post by GWR 101 on Aug 20, 2015 7:25:53 GMT
Hi Brian,
Many thanks for replying, great idea using brass angle sounds like a good plan. I was fortunate with the cleading as "a very nice man" at GLR Kennions rolled it to the correct diameter to fit over the insulation (at no extra charge) and posted it to me in a cardboard tube. I also hope to use the banding which also came coiled to the correct diameter to help hold the cleading in place.
Your plan to use balsa wood as insulation in the stay area seems like a good idea, I assume the heat wouldn't be an issue but how close to the firebox will it be ?. I am fortunate that I do not have that issue as the area around the stays is hidden by the tanks. I am now pondering on the best way to get the holes for the various fittings in the cleading, LBSC suggests making a punch which may be an option. Regards Paul
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Post by runner42 on Aug 20, 2015 8:04:01 GMT
Paul I was a little green with envy that you had the barrel cladding already rolled, but now I realise that the steam dome, safety valve and probably clack valve holes have to be put in place then it may not be a good idea, since this is more readily undertaken whilst the cladding is in the flat. But I suspect that you were aware of this and can overcome hole making in the round. I drilled the holes after marking out in the flat and because the hole takes on a different shape when the cladding is formed around the barrel I used a round file to produce the elliptical shape required. Of course the steam dome hole being large was produced by drilling a number of small holes inside the required diameter, pushing out and finishing with a round file. Although it was a snug fit I have a cover going over steam dome to hide any imperfections.
The balsa wood is more to cushion the cladding than being used as insulation, I assume that it can stand the temperature of the outer wrapper, Martin Evans recommended it in some publication I remember reading in the past.
Good luck with your intention to have Juliet running on steam by November, the backhead fittings must be completed. Have you had the boiler producing steam and its output being controlled by the regulator?
Brian |
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Post by GWR 101 on Aug 20, 2015 19:51:58 GMT
Brian I wasn't too sure about having it rolled although my club has rolls I don't so I accepted the suppliers offer. Perhaps in hindsight I may have taken the easy option which I may live to regret. I have had a look at the boiler and hopefully I may be able to recover the situation, the safety valve and steam dome have covers so the accuracy of the holes are not too critical. The clack valve bosses are 1/2" dia. and only about 1/16" proud so I am hoping to be able to make a reasonable attempt to cut these fairly neatly. I did wonder about making some dummy bosses to blend in with the cleading if I have a problem, my build is not prototypical so I do have some licence.
I have the water level and pressure gauges also the blow down valve, so I will press on with the other few fittings in between painting sessions, Juliet has a very sparse backhead.
I have the regulator made and tested on air but not steam, I am hopeful it will be ok as I changed to a screw type having failed miserably with the original design. Apart from the plumbing I still have to make the superheater elements so November may be a bit over optimistic but hey I will give it my best shot after all this build did start in 1970. Many thanks for your interest and help. Regards Paul
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