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Post by Roger on Mar 7, 2016 14:01:28 GMT
Yes Julian please show as much as poss. Soldering cones takes me several goes every time. I have no idea why it fails then eventually works as I do the same things as far as I can tell. Pete. I'm still a novice at Silver Soldering, but I started off heating it all far too quickly and boiling the flux like mad, then got it bright red. Now I mix the flux so it's much thicker and creamy, use loads of it and very gently evaporate the water from it, even if that takes several minutes. I heat it all slowly now and it hardly gets red hot before it melts. The best thing I bought was really thin Silver Solder wire that I form into a shape that hugs the joint, then bury it in flux. The benefit of doing it that way is that you know precisely when it's hot enough to melt the Silver Solder. So long as the wire is sitting in the pool of molten flux, it stays put and then just melts precisely where you need it. No more needs to be added and you get a very neat joint. |
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smallbrother
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Post by smallbrother on Mar 7, 2016 21:09:56 GMT
Yes Julian please show as much as poss. Soldering cones takes me several goes every time. I have no idea why it fails then eventually works as I do the same things as far as I can tell. Pete. I'm still a novice at Silver Soldering, but I started off heating it all far too quickly and boiling the flux like mad, then got it bright red. Now I mix the flux so it's much thicker and creamy, use loads of it and very gently evaporate the water from it, even if that takes several minutes. I heat it all slowly now and it hardly gets red hot before it melts. The best thing I bought was really thin Silver Solder wire that I form into a shape that hugs the joint, then bury it in flux. The benefit of doing it that way is that you know precisely when it's hot enough to melt the Silver Solder. So long as the wire is sitting in the pool of molten flux, it stays put and then just melts precisely where you need it. No more needs to be added and you get a very neat joint. I can't figure out what I do that is different when it decides to work. I have tried slow, fast, gentle, loads of flux, small amount of flux, re-applying flux and everything in between. Usually, just as I am about to throw it all in the bin, it suddenly flows into the joint. |
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Post by Roger on Mar 7, 2016 21:29:27 GMT
I'm still a novice at Silver Soldering, but I started off heating it all far too quickly and boiling the flux like mad, then got it bright red. Now I mix the flux so it's much thicker and creamy, use loads of it and very gently evaporate the water from it, even if that takes several minutes. I heat it all slowly now and it hardly gets red hot before it melts. The best thing I bought was really thin Silver Solder wire that I form into a shape that hugs the joint, then bury it in flux. The benefit of doing it that way is that you know precisely when it's hot enough to melt the Silver Solder. So long as the wire is sitting in the pool of molten flux, it stays put and then just melts precisely where you need it. No more needs to be added and you get a very neat joint. I can't figure out what I do that is different when it decides to work. I have tried slow, fast, gentle, loads of flux, small amount of flux, re-applying flux and everything in between. Usually, just as I am about to throw it all in the bin, it suddenly flows into the joint. I find that the joint has to be a lot hotter when you apply the rod to the joint because you have to take the flame away to apply it. If you make a ring of Silver Solder then it's there ready to melt in the right spot as soon as it's hot enough and without removing the flame. It means you can work at a lower temperature. I also find that once you've got molten metal on the joint, adding more works because the liquid metal quickly melts the rod you're adding. |
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 7, 2016 22:12:02 GMT
i will start a seperate thread on this ie cones/nipples to pipe ends showing a few test pieces. i really need a second pair of hands to take the pics though during the process! do you want to volunteer pete?! you can do the silver soldering and i will take the pics!
cheers,
julian
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
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Post by smallbrother on Mar 8, 2016 8:42:05 GMT
i will start a seperate thread on this ie cones/nipples to pipe ends showing a few test pieces. i really need a second pair of hands to take the pics though during the process! do you want to volunteer pete?! you can do the silver soldering and i will take the pics! cheers, julian I am looking after my unwell grandson for the next few days but am sure I can pop over soon and maybe we could video it. Pete. |
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 17, 2016 22:05:21 GMT
 I have been faffing about with various bits of he side tanks over the last week or two. I have fitted the rear driving wheel splashers to same, and currently sorting out all the blind fixing holes to attach to the running boards which is very boring. However, as a bit of light relief this evening I've made the top bits of the water tank fillers. These werent far different to making the cab spectacle plate glass rims, and used what i had left of an old 1917 cast brass bell clapper bearing from John Warner and Sons. I dont throw anything away! What remains of the bearing is to the right - it was originally 4" long. In fullsize these bits are rebated on the top which i have tried to copy. Just under 1 7/16" dia tight push fit onto 1 1/4" dia copper tube. The copper tube is fixed to the top of the side tanks via lugs silver soldered on the base underneath and 2 x 10BA screws to locate to the top of the side tanks. These will get soft soldered up with all the other bits of the side tanks hopefully very soon. The brass bits on the top need bits silver soldered on for the hinges and fastener clasp, then loctited onto the top of the copper tube. Cheers, Julian |
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 19, 2016 22:48:16 GMT
A bit more progress... I have made tha tank filler lids. These have a recess underneath, and a Cadburys chocolate button profile on top. The hinges are fiddly. I silver soldered on bits of 4mm sif bronze rod into a strip of brass. Once silver soldered the brass was soft enough to press over one of the filler lids to get the required contour. The shape of the Stroudley hinges is what I would describe as shield shaped, as easily seen from above in miniature I have tried to reproduce this. I cocked up on one cover being far too enthusiastic and drilling through both ends. These will be plugged in due course. The hinges are secured to the tank filler lids with 3 rivets as per fullsize. Anyway a few pics...   Cheers, Julian |
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Post by Roger on Mar 20, 2016 8:55:04 GMT
Stunning work Julian, they look superb.
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tim
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Post by tim on Mar 20, 2016 17:59:48 GMT
Lovely detail Julian, You're not by chance partial to Cadburys chocolate buttons are you!
Tim.
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 22, 2016 19:58:03 GMT
Here are the tank filler lids with knobs on. The first 2 went in the bin as the parting tool I used (55 thou) for the recess between knob base and top just didnt look right so went down to one of 28 thou. The knobs are screwed in to the tank lids with an 8BA thread. Ive also added the catches for the clasps, riveted to the tank lids with 3/64" brass rivets. The brass for the catches was hammered to work harden it - an old clockmakers trick. Ive started on the clasps - these are on the left. The roughly drilled out forked ends need filing to size etc. There is a tapped 10BA hole in the ends for a 'T' shaped handle that tightens down on the catch. These are going to be rather fragile so I might make the clasps removable.  Here is also the CJ Binnie drawing Ive been working to. The drawings arent quite accurate for the knobs or catches or clasps but are pretty good when compared to pics of fullsize.  Cheers, Julian |
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 23, 2016 20:39:34 GMT
I've finished the tank filler lid clasps  The bodies were a drilling and file job. The 'T' piece screwed handles were simply 2 10BA brass screws silver soldered into a strip of 1/16" brass which had been tapped 10BA. I then hamemered the brass strip to harden it, and filed the ends roughly to shape. I will clean up the rough filing a bit more immediately before i reach the painting stage. I have used the same method for making needle valves with handles attached for hydrostatic lubricator sight feed fittings. Cheers, Julian |
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 25, 2016 22:10:45 GMT
Here is this afternoon's work... I dont think Ive ever made such fiddly tank filler lids etc before! A nightmare in miniature! I decided the only easy way to silver solder the hinge blocks for the tank filler lids to the rims of the filler tube was to mill out a section of brass leaving at the top a section to give the required spacing. Then some very fiddly silver soldering. There is no room to add fixing screws or rivets. The first pic shows, to the left, one tank filler top with hinge blocks silver soldered to the rim, and to the right the second one after silver soldering before cutting off the spacer at the top.  The second pic is after silver soldering another block to the front for the clasp to fit onto.  I could do with a bit of advice please! The hinges with their holes are already fixed to the tank filler lid. I somehow need to now drill the holes in the hinge blocks for a pin to line up with the hole in the tank filler lid hinge. Any ideas please?! (The hole for the hinge pin will be 1/16" dia). Cheers, Julian |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2016 22:54:59 GMT
nice work Julian....an interesting dilemma, in the past when I've had to make similar hinges I have left the join of the tube to the strap as the last process with the tube held by it's pin and the lid in place I then soldered the joint( hope that makes sense). To do the pin now I think that I would remove the lid and drill a larger hole on one hinge block side (as close to pin centre as possible) , say nearest to camera. put lid back and drill through the tube into the hinge block furthest from camera. remove lid again, fill the larger hole (if drilled to a stock bar size this could be done easily with some suitable OD brass bar and loctite, or soft solder) , file flush and then replace the lid and repeat from the other side. Hope that makes sense, I guess you could try marking out but this may be a bit hit and miss..
cheers
Pete
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Post by Roger on Mar 25, 2016 23:14:16 GMT
Hi Julian,
That looks really good.
You've painted yourself into a corner with those holes, but here's one way out of it.
Make a small spacer that goes over the middle handle and another round spacer about 1/2" long that goes on the underside of the button.
Trap the lid on its side in the milling machine vice between the two spacers so that the hole in the hinge is vertical, but....
Ok, that's the way you line it up, but what you do is to set it up the same way I've described, but add the base part so it's got the 1/2" long spacer going through it. It's not trapped like the lid, it's hanging loose over the outside of the spacer.
Now you can carefully line up the hole in the lid with a drill in the milling machine chuck.
Once that's spot on, change to a small centre drill and slide the base part so it fits over the hinge. Use a small clamp or wedge something against the vice jaw to hold it in place while you centre drill the hole. When it breaks through, it ought to be exactly above the hole in the lid, so you can drill right through using that as the guide for the bottom hole.
I think that would work.
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dscott
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Post by dscott on Mar 25, 2016 23:51:47 GMT
Lovely work and inspiring to all us builders!!
Bullet bitten last week and abandoning all work in the house, workshop build,
greenhouse base build.....AND took my Terrier apart!! Set up punch bag in the corner
and many coins in the swear box?? £63 in total oh just covers joint subs at our track
for next year!!!
WELL 25 years of working in a place where they have all manner of brazing and welding kit!!!
I need to silver solder two bushes into the now free steam chest determined to have
something in steam this year!! £200 parts company for the privilege and a cylinder
joins the new brazing torch!!! Oh I miss work at lunchtime sometimes!!!
I had promised to finish all domestic projects first!!
I begin to reflect the impact on the hobby that bad drawings is still having and how
many other Terriers lurk under a cloud of one day I will fix!!! Plus others???
Yes to access the part the whole thing had to come apart!!
No wonder on a Speedy everything is on the outside except the water pump!!
David.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2016 7:52:48 GMT
Morning Julian.....I've had another simpler idea....take a length of flat bar...about 1/16 thick and wide enough to match or greater the height of the hinge block. Remove lid and clock in say 90 degrees and refit....this is to get the hinge clear of the blocks...place the flat bar on it's 1/16 edge up against the hatch ring touching the hinge. IE the bar resting on a flat surface with the hatch is being used as a template..you just need to mark the hole through the hinge pin tube..remove bar drill pin hole, reposition bar up against the hatch ring but this time alongside a hinge block and transfer the hole. I would just do this to one block..refit lid in it's correct place and drill through block' hinge pin hole into other block...that should do the job.....hope this makes sense...I'm using my phone which i don't find easy....  Cheers Pete |
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Lisa
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Post by Lisa on Mar 26, 2016 9:13:21 GMT
My thoughts: Blue the inside edges of the hinge block, put one of those nifty little sprung bars that hold a watch strap onto a watch into the hinge, fit the lid in place, then remove. The sprung watch-band pin should have left a line which stops on the centre of the hinge pin, measure and transfer to the outside, then drill.
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jma1009
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Post by jma1009 on Mar 26, 2016 10:40:56 GMT
Thank you Lisa, Pete, and Roger, and Jim S via email.
Pete is absolutely right I should have made the hinges on the lids after doing the hinge blocks. I will try the above suggestions but suspect I may have to remove the hinges from the tank filler lids and make new ones.
Incidentally for silver soldering small fiddly bits, I change the burner on my Sievert propane torch to 3940. Usually 3941 stays on the torch. 3940 has a small but very intense fierce flame which is good for localised heating on small bits.
Cheers,
Julian
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Post by donashton on Mar 26, 2016 11:28:25 GMT
Well I know an easier and guaranteed method which you all seem to have missed.
Collect together all the bits into a neat parcel and send them to Ynysddu!
The job will exceed your expectations and....Oh, don't forget the cheque for £500.
Oh hullo Julian - how are things with you?
Don.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2016 11:38:14 GMT
Well I know an easier and guaranteed method which you all seem to have missed. Collect together all the bits into a neat parcel and send them to Ynysddu! The job will exceed your expectations and....Oh, don't forget the cheque for £500. Oh hullo Julian - how are things with you? Don. well at least Julian won't need a stamp, just a SAE... Pete |
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