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Post by ejparrott on Feb 18, 2016 12:30:31 GMT
Dougal is not a public running passenger hauler, 1-1/8" cylinders will be fine. If in doubt, raise the boiler pressure, but you won't need to. Is it too small for public hauling? Surely it'd be as good as some of the 3 1/2" gauge engines? Cheers, Dan On an economics scale, larger engines hauling larger trains are more profitable than smaller engines hauling smaller trains. We've gone to great lengths to establish this at Rugby as we've progressed with our extension plans. So depending on your clubs status as regards public running, then yes it will pull passengers, just not very many of them. If you want to increase it's pulling power, then fill the tanks with lead instead of water. As she is she's little different to my Lion, and I wouldn't even consider public running with her.
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
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Post by smallbrother on Feb 18, 2016 13:09:59 GMT
I thought Dougal, like Scamp, Juliet, Titch etc, was supposed to be a relatively easy and inexpensive model on which to learn the skills of ME.
Larger passenger hauling or more detailed models would follow on from this start.
Pete.
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Post by ejparrott on Feb 18, 2016 13:21:55 GMT
But to learn the skills without getting hacked off means good quality and detailed drawings, which brings us back to Julian's excellent points yesterday about the Dougal drawings.
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Post by Cro on Feb 18, 2016 13:48:22 GMT
We run regularly for passengers but it still doesn't stop us using something small now and then, a little 08 or a 3 1/2" Conway or even my 3 1/2" Brit on rare occasions, we are in this hobby for our love of model engineering and the railways not to be economical and make money. Yes every club running for the public needs to make some money to survive but the one big problem I have with my club is the drive to always be passenger running and nothing else, it has taken the fun out of it and I am pushing more and more for this to change.
I don't think Dan ever stated he was after the next monster on the track to move people but more the fact he wants to learn (whether that be by finding the mistake and correcting them or having help to do so) he wants a model that he can run at his track and take passengers now and then.
I think rather than us all saying what we don't want from this loco or what we think is C*** about it we encourage Dan to solve the problems when they arise and congratulate him on how well he is doing in such a short space of time. The last thing I would want as a beginner is to be told all these issues (and in the case of the boiler some that people may not understand or be aware of yet - not suggesting this is you Dan) but rather have the encouragement and be told where to look for issues and how to think about over comming them. I think Julian is trying to do this but some of the posts may not really come across in this way when first read, I know thats what I thought when I read them.
Maybe I'm wrong but we can't always all be right can we?!
Adam
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Post by ejparrott on Feb 18, 2016 14:42:12 GMT
I thought Julian's posts very very helpful, but then I haven't been a beginner or a novice for a very long time.
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gwr7800
Part of the e-furniture
Member of Portsmouth mes
Posts: 384
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Post by gwr7800 on Feb 19, 2016 11:38:43 GMT
Iam not in the same league as Adam or Julian but I pottery on to the best of my ability, Iam not a beginner but even after 30 odd years Iam learning something new all the time this forum is a wealth of information and I really do appreciate the posts back to me after I've posted a question. Long may it continue thanks chaps cheers Chris
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dc309
Seasoned Member
Posts: 146
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Post by dc309 on Feb 21, 2016 15:26:10 GMT
Thanks for your replies chaps, they are much appreciated. Regarding public running, I'm not overly fussed about it to be honest - If I can, I will and if I can't, I won't! At the end of the day, I wanted to build something that is small and simple based on a "full size" loco rather than a freelance that would be "cheap" and "easy" to build. I didn't fancy building a big loco mainly because space doesn't allow it at home and because I think it would have put me off with so many parts to make! With the boiler, I shall have a word with my inspector at the club. ejparrott would you be able to give me your opinion on the boiler if I sent you a drawing via email? Cheers, Dan
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Post by ejparrott on Feb 21, 2016 15:41:03 GMT
I have no objections at all, and I'd be glad to help.
I apologize if my comments relating to Public Running suggested that the engine wasn't worth building or that engines should always be used for Public Running, that wasn't the intention. I have 2 engines that are play things only and I enjoy them just as much. Mu Lilla was a passenger hauler at Swansea for many years but she's a little poorly at the moment, and my current project is the one that is intended as the heavy hauler. I do enjoy hauling loads and giving the engine something to do, but I do also enjoy taking out the other 2 and just entertaining myself.
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dc309
Seasoned Member
Posts: 146
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Post by dc309 on Feb 21, 2016 18:07:51 GMT
Thanks for that I've sent you PM
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dc309
Seasoned Member
Posts: 146
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Post by dc309 on Feb 23, 2016 20:28:10 GMT
The favourite part of the month has rolled round again - Pay day! I've just ordered some material for Dougal, along with the saddle/port casting. I'm just looking at the drawing and plucking up the courage to machine it! To date, it will be the most complex machining work I will have done. Hopefully I shall get the horns fitted and machined in the next couple of weeks. I wish I could get into the workshop more often, but it just doesn't happen! Another question for you chaps in the know... How do you go about painting a loco? Do you paint it as you go along, or strip it down afterwards to paint? Cheers, Dan
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Post by ejparrott on Feb 23, 2016 23:31:52 GMT
I paint as I go, keeps the rust at bay and keeps it looking good, plus I couldn't stand stripping it all and then taking another 2 years to paint it and put it back together
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2016 9:15:18 GMT
I guess I'm between both worlds....I will paint when I'm happy that I have little to no more drilling jobs to do...so my tender chassis is painted and lined but the body isn't other than some primer and black for the bunker...I'll probably paint the body once I have finished the loco wheels and then paint/line all together...I expect this alone to take a number of months. Same goes for the loco chassis, it's close but still needs more work that would mark any paintwork and I'm always finding more details to do, for example this week I discovered that 4472 circa 1935 was refitted with front steps behind the buffer beam. I'm sure that I will discover many more parts to add before she's completed, if she ever is.... Like Ed I don't think that I'd enjoy having to totally strip a loco for painting although I do accept that this would probably be the way to go for an exhibition model Pete
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dc309
Seasoned Member
Posts: 146
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Post by dc309 on Mar 4, 2016 17:53:12 GMT
Thanks for that. I think it'll be painting as I go along... Seeing as Reeves had an offer on, I decided to get some castings whilst they were on offer! Some machining to go at..!
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dc309
Seasoned Member
Posts: 146
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Post by dc309 on Mar 4, 2016 20:49:37 GMT
Managed to get a little bit done this evening. Holes in the top of the horn castings - Only about an hours work, but still a bit more off the list Dan
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
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Post by smallbrother on Mar 4, 2016 21:04:40 GMT
What are the holes for?
Regardless, I wish I could get on and do stuff in that sort of quick time!
Pete.
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dc309
Seasoned Member
Posts: 146
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Post by dc309 on Mar 4, 2016 21:11:17 GMT
Hi Pete,
Looking at the drawings, they are for the springs to go through to sit on top of the axleboxes. The centre one is for a rod to tension the springs I'm guessing, as there is a "spring plate" at the top of the springs.
Cheers, Dan
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
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Post by smallbrother on Mar 4, 2016 21:28:25 GMT
Juliet has holes in the top of the axleboxes. The springs sit in these and compress against the underside of the top of the horns. I haven't drilled these yet, but I did manage to finish drilling the holes for the axles this morning.
It was absolutely bloody freezing. I was waiting for a delivery for my wife so I couldn't close the door and warm the workshop up. The metal sucked the heat from my body from fingers to shoulders.
I took the dog for a walk to warm up in the rain and sleet!
Pete.
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dc309
Seasoned Member
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Post by dc309 on Mar 4, 2016 21:54:00 GMT
That reminds me speaking of springs... Where do you obtain such a thing for a loco this small? I can't see them listed on the Reeves website.
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smallbrother
Elder Statesman
Errors aplenty, progress slow, but progress nonetheless!
Posts: 2,269
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Post by smallbrother on Mar 4, 2016 22:39:05 GMT
That reminds me speaking of springs... Where do you obtain such a thing for a loco this small? I can't see them listed on the Reeves website. GLR Kennions is where I got mine. I don't know how good they are though as they are still in the packet and it will be months/years before they do any work.
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Post by ejparrott on Mar 5, 2016 9:28:14 GMT
Depends how fussy you are. Several of the ME suppliers stock springs but they list them by size not by rates. Proper spring suppliers like #Lee Spring or Entex stock them by all different sorts of rates, but the drawback tends to be minimum order qty.
In all honesty, I wouldn't bother with the springs just yet. I would put some solid rods in, such that the axleboxes are clamped at the designed height. When you're nearly finished, you can weigh the finished engine, and use a real weight to calculate exactly what spring you need, and pop them in later on. My enormous Manning Wardle has her axleboxes clamped and they'll stay like that for the next couple of years until she's nearly done, then I can weigh her and use a real weight to calculate what I need in terms of leafs. It won't prevent you running the chassis on air, even on steam at home. You just won't be able to run her on a track.
Poor springing can make an otherwise excellent engine diabolical on the track.
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